Disney pulling all content from Netflix, launching own streaming service

As we watch content providers pull out of Netflix, we understand why Netflix was and is investing so heavily in original content.
 
I'm just saying that for decades that the nba's biggest advertisers were McDonald's, coke, Gatorade, and the athletic companies - particularly Nike.

Their pockets are not as deep...exasperating the problems with disney's stupid NBA contract.

Most of what I have read suggests that viewership is healthy and ad spending is increasing. Specific to 2017, the worst thing to happen was that so many playoff series were short. Many 4-game sweeps and the finals only went 5 games compared to 2016's drama-filled 7 game matchup. Losing those extra games cost them hundreds of millions in ad revenue year-to-year.


You know what you're talking about...but your argument that tv isn't "dumb" and that scripted tv is getting better simply doesn't pass the sniff test.

No way on that...spout all the numbers you want there..there has definitely been a shift in the audience as far as both their commitment to tv and the quality of tv they are being fed.

Seriously...turn on the history channel...or AandE...or ABC for that matter and watch an hour or two...then Try to get the blood to flow back to your brain.

Without overthinking, here's my personal list of some of the top shows currently in production:

Veep (HBO)
You're the Worst (FX)
The Good Place (NBC)
The Expanse (Syfy)
Bosch (Amazon)
The Americans (FX)
Legion (FX)
Colony (USA)
Brockmire (IFC)
Unbreakable Kimmy Schmidt (Netflix)
Daredevil (Netflix)
The Goldbergs (ABC)
Last Man on Earth (Fox)

(And objectively, there are a lot of very good shows being made today which aren't on that list. I've never seen an episode of Game of Thrones, Walking Dead or Better Call Saul, all of which have a rabid following and near universal acclaim.)

I'll stack that list up against many other years...especially back in the 80s and 90s. In those days, once you get past the cream of the crop (Seinfeld, Frasier, Hill Street Blues, ER) you quickly come across such "top rated" shows as Murder She Wrote, Empty Nest, Alf, Hunter, Caroline in the City and Coach.

We all have our sentimental favorites from our youth, but in terms of writing, acting and production quality, there's really no comparison.
 
Are there numbers to support that or are you just guessing based upon cord cutters?

There are numbers, though I don't have any to hand. I might do a search later. The short version is, right now the numbers aren't huge, and it's way to soon to call a trend, but the hours per week of TV engagement have dropped.

The issue, as I said elsewhere though is not cord-cutters in the sense of people not wanting to pay cable fees (I'm on of those, but I recognize I'm a niche), it's people opting to spend disposable income on other entertainment forms entirely. Sure there are a lot of people who can drop $80 on a cable package and $40-50 on their online gaming habit, but there are plenty of others who're going to need to choose one or the other.

When I ask young people I know why the cut the cord, the answer thy give is cost, but that's not the real answer. The cost matters to them only because they're spending their time and money doing other things (eating out, movies, whatever). It's hard to justify a $140 a month Comcast bill if most of your TV is watched and internet is consumed on a cellphone while commuting.

The days of companies being able to rely on a largely homogenous customer base are done at least for the foreseeable future. The TV industry will work this out in time.
 
When I ask young people I know why the cut the cord, the answer thy give is cost, but that's not the real answer. The cost matters to them only because they're spending their time and money doing other things (eating out, movies, whatever). It's hard to justify a $140 a month Comcast bill if most of your TV is watched and internet is consumed on a cellphone while commuting.

I agree with this. And it's not just that they want to spend the money elsewhere, but also some currently view $10-12 Netflix or Hulu as adequate to satisfy their entertainment needs. To that, I would say 2 things:

1) If providers continue to pull their content from Netflix, Prime and Hulu, those services will individually lose value. They are trying to beef up their library of exclusive content, but (IMO) it's a real mixed bag. Is Netflix worth $120 per year for House of Cards, Flaked and The Ranch?

2) Meanwhile, these network services will garner their own appeal to others. To pick two known quantities, a combination of FX ($6) and AMC ($5) would cost about the same as Netflix or Hulu. Assuming those services provide live/same day access to new episodes of their series (Legion, Atlanta, Walking Dead, etc.) plus a vast library of legacy content and licensed feature films, I can easily see consumers picking those stand-alone network services over a Netflix or Hulu.
 


So you admit that you're willing to pay $22 per month for the content Netflix and Hulu choose to offer, but you can't envision another consumer wanting to pay $6 for FX content? Or $6 for a CBS library? Or $5 for AMC?

Yes. Right now, i'll pay $22 for Netflix and Hulu, but only because of the vast variety of content they offer. AND, its content that I like to watch.

I'm saying that I can't envision me or my family buying the extra single streaming channels. We haven't so far when Amazon has offered them to us. And, I really don't think we'll be alone. When folks start buying the all the extra channels and see they have spent their way back to a cable TV plan, they're going to cut back on the extras. Not to mention, just streaming the content you get on cable, with limited libraries, isn't going to solve the problem of "nothing on worth watching."

FWIW, I know there will be folks who will buy the Disney stream just because its Disney. But to be truthful, a lot of folks might watch a Disney movie or TV show on Hulu or Netflix or fill in the blank, but won't may not buy a seperate stream just for Disney.

tjkraz, we're going to have to agree to disagree.
 
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I agree with this. And it's not just that they want to spend the money elsewhere, but also some currently view $10-12 Netflix or Hulu as adequate to satisfy their entertainment needs. To that, I would say 2 things:

1) If providers continue to pull their content from Netflix, Prime and Hulu, those services will individually lose value. They are trying to beef up their library of exclusive content, but (IMO) it's a real mixed bag. Is Netflix worth $120 per year for House of Cards, Flaked and The Ranch?

2) Meanwhile, these network services will garner their own appeal to others. To pick two known quantities, a combination of FX ($6) and AMC ($5) would cost about the same as Netflix or Hulu. Assuming those services provide live/same day access to new episodes of their series (Legion, Atlanta, Walking Dead, etc.) plus a vast library of legacy content and licensed feature films, I can easily see consumers picking those stand-alone network services over a Netflix or Hulu.

I think it does become a problem for everyone when the AMC's and FX's and Disney's start pulling their content and going direct.

At $5/pop and possibly sep apps, it could add up for families.

Perhaps the single market is large enough to not worry. Families may still look to cable to satisfy the variety need.

I just know, personally, keeping up with 3 subscriptions to satisfy a family of 5 got old. (first world problem)

Couldn't imagine having 5-10.

Maybe small conglomerates will form/bundle.

It'll be interesting to watch in unfold in the next 2-5 years.
 
Seriously...turn on the history channel...or AandE...or ABC for that matter and watch an hour or two...then Try to get the blood to flow back to your brain.

That is my biggest complaint with TV. In years past, most of the time there was something on TV that you wanted to watch. Not anymore. The content they provide you just isn't worth the money you spend to get it.

I used to spend hours watching the History Channel. Now, I can't stomach it. And that channel isn't the only one......
 
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Yes. Right now, i'll pay $22 for Netflix and Hulu, but only because of the vast variety of content they offer. AND, its content that I like to watch.

I'm saying that I can't envision me or my family buying the extra single streaming channels. We haven't so far when Amazon has offered them to us. And, I really don't think we'll be alone.

No, you won't be alone. But not everyone will follow your lead either. The Netflix that you know and love is destined for change. YOU may continue to enjoy the variety those services provide. For others, all it takes is removal of a favorite series to shift loyalties.

In a few weeks, CBS is debuting a new Star Trek show exclusively on its $6 per month All Access service. There WILL be people who buy just for that. And some will drop Netflix to help balance their budget. There are people who signed up for Showtime just for the Twin Peaks revival.

Some people claim to already rotate among multiple services, binging on Netflix for 2-3 months before cancelling for Hulu or HBO.

When folks start buying the all the extra channels and see they have spent their way back to a cable TV plan, they're going to cut back on the extras.

Yes, some will. And many millions will stick with full-blown cable.

But for others it's not just a case of adding more and more and more services. It's a case of trading one for another. Look at the library of FX/FXX alone:

The Americans, Legion, Atlanta, Baskets, Better Things, Louie, Fargo, American Horror Story, Justified, Sons of Anarchy, Archer, It's Always Sunny in Philadelphia, The League, You're the Worst, etc.

Right now, all of those are staples on streaming services. But when they disappear from Netflix, Prime and Hulu, there will absolutely be people who trade their Netflix subscription for direct access to FX.

FWIW, I know there will be folks who will buy the Disney stream just because its Disney. But to be truthful, a lot of folks might watch a Disney movie or TV show on Hulu or Netflix or fill in the blank, but won't may not buy a seperate stream just for Disney.

Well, it's not about buying a Disney service "just because it's Disney." And I agree a dedicated Disney service won't be for the casual viewer.

When my kids were younger, shows like Mickey Mouse Clubhouse, Handy Manny and Little Einsteins were the go-to programming. In later years it became things like Zach & Cody, Dog With a Blog, Star Wars Clone Wars, Phineas & Ferb and Gravity Falls. Disney still provides reliable, family-friendly fare.

Right now, a lot of that content is available on Netflix. But when it drops off Netflix, cord cutters will only have the Disney streaming service as an option. The library they are likely to offer, including theatrical films and likely some exclusive programming, will make it a very reasonable purchase for some families. And they won't need 50 million households to make it a success.
 
Even History and Discovery have turned to Reality. TV today just sucks to be honest. Like I said earlier, I have no Cable or Sat. Just Netflix, Prime and OTA. Guess what my TV is on a lot of the time. PBS. I get 4 PBS channels in my area OTA. Create being my favorite.

I also agree with what someone said above. I watch Disney on Netflix because its there. I wouldn't exclusively pay for it. I have plenty of Disney DVD's. And honestly, I don't find Disney programming to be very good outside of their movies and Disney has kind of over saturated me on Star Wars right now. I never thought I would say that but it has.
 
I think it does become a problem for everyone when the AMC's and FX's and Disney's start pulling their content and going direct.

At $5/pop and possibly sep apps, it could add up for families.

Everyone has to make their own decision. That's the only point I'm trying to make. Right now, Netflix and Prime are still very economical options because they aggregate content from so many different providers. It's sort of humorous when Netflix/Hulu/Prime subscribers say "TV sucks today" because the content they're streaming on those services IS TV!

Right now...in 2017...$22 for what Netflix and Hulu has to offer is a good deal.

But in a couple years, it might make more sense to spread that same money over a Disney subscription PLUS AMC, PLUS FX, PLUS CBS. That package would yield first-run episodes of stuff like Walking Dead, Preacher, Americans, Star Trek and a dozen other series which won't be available on another service, while still adding up to about $20 per month.

I just know, personally, keeping up with 3 subscriptions to satisfy a family of 5 got old. (first world problem)

Couldn't imagine having 5-10.

Last year Apple devices introduced a "TV" app which aggregates content from multiple network apps. There's room for improvement but it works pretty well. At a glance it shows what's available across all network apps installed, and will automatically launch the proper app to stream.
 
Everyone has to make their own decision. That's the only point I'm trying to make. Right now, Netflix and Prime are still very economical options because they aggregate content from so many different providers. It's sort of humorous when Netflix/Hulu/Prime subscribers say "TV sucks today" because the content they're streaming on those services IS TV!

Right now...in 2017...$22 for what Netflix and Hulu has to offer is a good deal.

But in a couple years, it might make more sense to spread that same money over a Disney subscription PLUS AMC, PLUS FX, PLUS CBS. That package would yield first-run episodes of stuff like Walking Dead, Preacher, Americans, Star Trek and a dozen other series which won't be available on another service, while still adding up to about $20 per month.

That's definitely true, but getting those 4 subscriptions will probably cost a little more. And you are most likely going to get less. And if that trend continues.....
 
The Netflix that you know and love is destined for change. YOU may continue to enjoy the variety those services provide. For others, all it takes is removal of a favorite series to shift loyalties.

I agree. However, when the day comes when we feel that Netflix and Hulu are no longer a good value for us (i.e., nothing on we want to watch) we will ditch them like we did Dish Network, and look for something else.
 
That's definitely true, but getting those 4 subscriptions will probably cost a little more. And you are most likely going to get less. And if that trend continues.....

Getting less is inevitable. The golden age of Netflix, et al is likely coming to an end. Cord cutters are kicking the broadcasters right between the legs. With every single person who cancels their cable or sat subscriptions, AMC loses money, Disney loses, Time Warner loses, Fox loses....

Networks will try anything to get that money back.

When cable was still flying high, the modest additional sums they would get from licensing reruns to Netflix was icing on the cake. Now these nets have realized they can't afford to let that content go cheap. They're gambling that people will pay $4-6 extra per month for access to their favorite shows.

Those who aren't terribly picky in their entertainment will still have choices. If you'd just as soon watch Netflix originals like Flaked or Ozark or OITNB, by all means stay with Netflix. They will continue to build their original library, while filling in with whatever broadcast reruns the networks are willing to let go.

But if you want The Walking Dead, Preacher or Better Call Saul, soon the only options will be AMC's subscription service, cable/sat subscription or buy the series on iTunes, Google Play, etc.
 
Disney content on Netflix has been great for people who don't buy the Disney movies but really for my family everything Disney that is on Netflix, other than Civil War, we already own and even have most of those titles available to stream on DMA.

We have no plans on adding whatever Disney/ESPN is going to sell.

So my question...are really that many people going to pay for a Disney only streaming service when those who are big Disney fans will already have access to most of the same movies with their own DVD/BR library or stream thru DMA?
 
Disney content on Netflix has been great for people who don't buy the Disney movies but really for my family everything Disney that is on Netflix, other than Civil War, we already own and even have most of those titles available to stream on DMA.

We have no plans on adding whatever Disney/ESPN is going to sell.

So my question...are really that many people going to pay for a Disney only streaming service when those who are big Disney fans will already have access to most of the same movies with their own library?


I think you overestimate how many people buy the movies versus just casually watch them. We don't really buy the movies, but we've watched Moana a few times on Netflix. We probably wouldn't have done that if we had to rent it, we would have found something else to watch. We just aren't that serious about the movies, but we love the parks. I think there is a huge universe of people that watch the movies on Netflix because its easy, but not if they have to own them or pay for a separate stream.

Financially, if this deal was only worth 300MM as is talked about, it's small potatoes for Disney. It won't take much for a stream to make up for that revenue. But for me the question is how to maximize the revenue. If the next couple years was worth 500MM, and then 1BB for 3 years after that, I'm not sure running your own stream is the right direction as the numbers rise. But we are really in the early stages of this shift from cable. Time will tell what the most profitable version of the next evolution will be.
 
The next thing to happen is we will go from an "unlimited" data world...back to a hefty usuage charge.

The cable/cell/internet companies have been scheming for this on Capitol Hill for awhile...ever hear of "net neutrality"?

The reality is that those companies - Comcast, Verizon, at&t - have bought up pieces so they are in position to get their money SOMEHOW. And if it's not Through broadcast...it will be through data.

People HATE paying fees for tv, phones, and the Internet...it has always been this way. We can't "touch" the product...so it's automatically a ripoff in our subconscious. That's why it's always been a hostage scenario...between us and them.
 
I think you overestimate how many people buy the movies versus just casually watch them. We don't really buy the movies, but we've watched Moana a few times on Netflix. We probably wouldn't have done that if we had to rent it, we would have found something else to watch. We just aren't that serious about the movies, but we love the parks. I think there is a huge universe of people that watch the movies on Netflix because its easy, but not if they have to own them or pay for a separate stream.

Financially, if this deal was only worth 300MM as is talked about, it's small potatoes for Disney. It won't take much for a stream to make up for that revenue. But for me the question is how to maximize the revenue. If the next couple years was worth 500MM, and then 1BB for 3 years after that, I'm not sure running your own stream is the right direction as the numbers rise. But we are really in the early stages of this shift from cable. Time will tell what the most profitable version of the next evolution will be.

Agree...home media purchase is on the decline...people are being trained not to have a physical or even digital "copy" of a movie anymore...it's evolution.
 
So my question...are really that many people going to pay for a Disney only streaming service when those who are big Disney fans will already have access to most of the same movies with their own DVD/BR library or stream thru DMA?

You're thinking movies only. That's small potatoes.

Young couple gets married. Has their first child. Time to start introducing some educational television. They're cord cutters so no access to traditional cable/sat. But for $8 per month, suddenly they have access to every episode of Mickey Mouse Clubhouse and Doc McStuffins ever made.

Child gets a little older...now it's time to binge Phineas & Ferb or Avengers cartoons.

Older still...Girl Meets World, Liv N Maddie and dozens of other tween-friendly shows in their archives.

Not to mention 20 years worth of Disney Channel original movies and theatrical films that parents didn't bother buying previously. Disney could dig deeper and add stuff like Duck Tails, Rescue Rangers, The Muppet Show, Apple Dumpling Gang, Herbie the Love Bug and any other niche media for which Netflix never wanted to pay, but might bring subscribers to this type of service.

For the adults, don't be surprised if they start to offer original programming. I think the Muppets would be a prime candidate for a streaming-only show. Small rabid fan base with no need to worry about network ratings. You better believe there are people who would pay $8-10 per month for 4 weeks' of episodes of a new Muppet Show.

Maybe an exclusive live action Marvel show. Over time they could pull streaming rights from Netflix for whatever ABC shows are fully owned, everything from Lost to Agents of Shield.

I doubt this will be a slim library of recent releases. And with the stuff gone off Netflix et al, the only other options for viewing Disney programming will be a traditional cable subscription or buying entire DVD/streaming films or season sets.
 
The next thing to happen is we will go from an "unlimited" data world...back to a hefty usuage charge.

The cable/cell/internet companies have been scheming for this on Capitol Hill for awhile...ever hear of "net neutrality"?

The reality is that those companies - Comcast, Verizon, at&t - have bought up pieces so they are in position to get their money SOMEHOW. And if it's not Through broadcast...it will be through data.

We've already seen this. Comcast internet has already gone from "unlimited" to a 1 TB data cap nationwide. Each additional 50 GB over that is $10 for the overage (capped very "generously" at $200 per month).

AT&T Fiber in my area has a similar 1 TB data cap with $10/50 GB overage (capped at $100 per month) unless you bundle their U-verse TV service with their internet package. So cord cutters get capped while TV subscribers do not.

In a year or two when much more content is streaming in 4k HDR, that 1 TB is going to get very tight for many people.

And once net neutrality goes away under the current administration, these internet providers will definitely start getting their money on the back end as well. Pure media companies like Disney and Netflix are going to get gouged by the likes of AT&T and Comcast for access to their pipes. Which means the price per month for the streaming services is going to have to go up to compensate.
 
We've already seen this. Comcast internet has already gone from "unlimited" to a 1 TB data cap nationwide. Each additional 50 GB over that is $10 for the overage (capped very "generously" at $200 per month).

AT&T Fiber in my area has a similar 1 TB data cap with $10/50 GB overage (capped at $100 per month) unless you bundle their U-verse TV service with their internet package. So cord cutters get capped while TV subscribers do not.

In a year or two when much more content is streaming in 4k HDR, that 1 TB is going to get very tight for many people.

And once net neutrality goes away under the current administration, these internet providers will definitely start getting their money on the back end as well. Pure media companies like Disney and Netflix are going to get gouged by the likes of AT&T and Comcast for access to their pipes. Which means the price per month for the streaming services is going to have to go up to compensate.

Totally agree...

Which means disney should have sold Capitol cities at its peak value...say 2005...and used the cash to refocus on businesses they CAN control...

Namely their resort business and producing high end tv and movies that they can sell/ransom to the cable companies and now offer direct without retribution.

If they had done that...instead of beating a dying horse...they would have been positioned as an established "streaming network" that the public would insist on like netflix. Instead of a startup with broadcast networks that are sliding backwards at an alarming pace
 

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