5th Park inevitable ?

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Well, the last US park (DCA) opened with more than 20.

Umm... I don't think so. Though it did open with more than DHS or AK. 1) California Screaming, 2) Golden Zephyr, 3) Grizzly River Run, 4) King Triton's Carousel, 5) Mulholland Madness, 6) Orange Stinger, and 7) Soarin.

It's important to remember that DL and WDW are very different in terms of management.

AK -- 1) Dinosaur 2) Safari 3) Wildlife Express 4) The boats to nowhere? Shortly After: 5) Kali River Rapids

DHS -- 1) Great Movie Ride 2) Studio Backlot Shortly after: 3) Star Tours
 
I find it kind of interesting when this topic comes up that people really want a 5th Park. I get the desire for something new and exciting, but when you think of how MGM (at the time) and AK opened, what opened with them, how they were really half filled out parks at best and still remain less than full day parks for many people, a new Park is just asking for something that isn't going to live up to the promise.

Disney isn't going to open a park with 10 rides. It's going to open with 3, maybe 4. A few shows and a bunch of themed shops with a handful of not so good restaurants and maybe 1 or two that are good and unique. How attractive does that really sound for another $100+ ticket? Wouldn't you rather your current $100 ticket to DHS get another attraction or three? A better restaurant or two? Something actually fun in Launchbay?

As a consumer, aren't we all better off if they actually invest in EPCOT, DHS, and AK to the level of MK? Why push to buy another ticket? Another Park? For me, logically, I want Disney to finish what they have.

A 5th park? No thanks. Not right now. Maybe in 20 years. Investment in what they have? Yes please. Lots and lots of it to help with the crowding and the ballooning ticket costs. Well done recently on the investment Disney. Now keep it going at this level for the next 20 years. Maybe then EPCOT, DHS, and AK will be completely built out.

Then we can talk about a 5th Gate.

It would come down to the overall theme. Not every park needs dozens of rides because they can have other things to do. When Animal Kingdom opened it was very much a full day park for us. There was so much to explore and see. The rides were a bonus to a perfectly themed everything. And it didn't take long for them to build up more attractions to add more time to do, the animals were the main attraction and could easily take up days of a trip if desired. MGM opened a little worse off, but again only a couple years in and it was very much a full day park, and growing up, was the park I always wanted to spend the most time in because to me it had the most to see. Long rides and shows ate up a lot of time. MGM only became a half day park when they closed half the place for expansions. And then even currently, Epcot has next to nothing to ride that is a must do, but it can very much eat up an entire day.
A new park wouldn't necessary need dozens of rides because there can be many other things to do, and that is something that Disney World in particularly had always excelled at compared to other parks around the world.
 
You’re forgetting some - Superstar Limo, Sun Wheel, and Jumping Jellyfish. But I should have said more than 10 rides and more than 20 attractions.

Of course people still complained it wasn’t enough.
 


I can't see them ever being willing to spend the money for an additional park. There's no need. They have proven that they can simply increase prices whenever they feel they need more revenue. I think you all know that they didn't just increase the ticket price this past October, they also increased the parking fee, added a parking fee at the resorts, increased the snack prices, and increased the Magic Band price. They make a tremendous profit from the timeshare units, and they are adding to them. In short, why spend megabucks to increase your profits when you can simply increase prices once or twice a year. And in my opinion, that will be true for a good many years going forward. I didn't notice lesser crowds when I was there last month.

I agree fully. The crowds appear to be growing. I wish that Disney would do something to accommodate more people (such as adding more attractions and rides), and I know they are doing some of that, but probably not fast enough.

We were there last week (December 11 & 12), for a quick overnight. Not our typical trip, just a perfect storm of unused vacation, crazy low airfare on Frontier ($20 each way), and a few unused DVC points. Typically the period right after Thanksgiving thru mid-December was a low period. It is a couple of weeks between two vacation periods, many schools are wrapping up the semesters or perhaps even having finals.

Magic Kingdom was busier than I had expected. Not as crazy as other times, but as we walked, we say a 70 minute wait for Peter Pan, a 135 minute wait for 7DMT, and 90 minutes for Space mountain (which is where we were headed with our fastpass). This was at 2:00 in the afternoon. When I thought about it, I was saying to my wife that if someone just walked into the park then, and wanted to ride those three popular rides, that was 5 hours of waiting for what amounts to probably less than 15 minutes of ride time.

Obviously, we love the way Disney is designed, and that all of the rides are themed. But, one thing I do like about Hershey Park is that near many of the big rides they will have a small area of a few kid rides. I was thinking about that as I saw tons of people just “Hanging Around” in Pandora apparently waiting for the rest of their families to get off FoP. Would be nice if the kids had something else to do, especially since there is such a long wait for that ride.

But, to your point, People just keep on coming, so they must be doing something right.
 
It’s not that it wasn’t enough it sucked...
When there a tons of theme park history pages on YouTube that devote an episode or multiple to superstar limo because of how absolutely atrocious it was, you know your park wasn’t in good shape from day 1
 


I’d rather see a resort in Texas than a fifth park in Florida.

I would put the odds on that at as close to 0 as it is possible to get. Cheap flights make it unnecessary to recreate so much infrastructure. But Texas loves to throw money at companies, so who knows? If they offer to pay for the land, pay to build 1/2 of it, and give it tax free for the next 100 years, Disney might go for it.
 
Disney isn't going to open a park with 10 rides
Not trying to be whatever but this is honestly what I’m expecting out of fantastic worlds, the third gate at universal. A couple rides with 3 times as many gift shops

Also just throwing this out there because it was mentioned, mgm wasn’t really supposed to be a park. It was supposed to be a working studio with a couple rides sprinkled here and there. Production never came and the park maxed out capacity a lot in 1989 so they kept building into the production grounds and eliminating length from the tram route. Animal kingdom I have no idea why it opened with so little other than budget cuts to beastly kingdomme
 
I’d rather see a resort in Texas than a fifth park in Florida.

That would be a horrible decision from a business standpoint. Disney wants to increase length of stay for their on property resorts and length of stay in the parks. This would just cause many people in that region, people who use to stay 6-8 nights in Orlando, to now stay 1-2 nights at the new single gate. Will never happen.
 
I find it kind of interesting when this topic comes up that people really want a 5th Park. I get the desire for something new and exciting, but when you think of how MGM (at the time) and AK opened, what opened with them, how they were really half filled out parks at best and still remain less than full day parks for many people, a new Park is just asking for something that isn't going to live up to the promise.

Disney isn't going to open a park with 10 rides. It's going to open with 3, maybe 4. A few shows and a bunch of themed shops with a handful of not so good restaurants and maybe 1 or two that are good and unique. How attractive does that really sound for another $100+ ticket? Wouldn't you rather your current $100 ticket to DHS get another attraction or three? A better restaurant or two? Something actually fun in Launchbay?

As a consumer, aren't we all better off if they actually invest in EPCOT, DHS, and AK to the level of MK? Why push to buy another ticket? Another Park? For me, logically, I want Disney to finish what they have.

A 5th park? No thanks. Not right now. Maybe in 20 years. Investment in what they have? Yes please. Lots and lots of it to help with the crowding and the ballooning ticket costs. Well done recently on the investment Disney. Now keep it going at this level for the next 20 years. Maybe then EPCOT, DHS, and AK will be completely built out.

Then we can talk about a 5th Gate.

I would love to see a fifth gate because new is fun and it would be interesting to see Disney design something from scratch with the latest technology. We'll certainly get a taste of that with SWGE.

To your point I agree and don't agree at the same time. I think they should expand, update and repopulate the existing parks because the MK essentially sees double the crowds of the other parks. They need another park that demands that much attention whether that's an existing park or a new one. Right now I don't think Epcot has a chance at this, nor does AK. The addition of SWGE is going to make a dent in the next few years, but I don't think it has enough capacity and attractions to bring the park from 10-12M to 18-20M+.

DHS is going to need another SWGE type of land (Marvel Land if they actually hate the rights to it) to get that many people going to the park every day consistently over time. Many people hit up MK twice in a vacation, DHS is going to need more to get people to go twice.

That's why the "dream" of a fifth gate is always around. Disney truly does not have a second 2-day park like MK and I don't think you'll be able to get that out of AK and Epcot no matter what kind of additions you make.
 
A 5th gate would be so expensive I don't think it'll ever happen. I think they'll keep expanding the current parks little by little, but a new 5th park? The cost would be enormous.

Animal Kingdom opened about 20 years ago and cost about One Billion Dollars to build (1.5B in 2018 money). Pandora alone supposedly was in the 400 to 500 Million range. A new park would easily cost 3 to 4 Billion, maybe more. Shanghai Disney was 5.5B but that included the resorts too. Labor is much cheaper in China as well.
 
I would love to see a fifth gate because new is fun and it would be interesting to see Disney design something from scratch with the latest technology. We'll certainly get a taste of that with SWGE.

To your point I agree and don't agree at the same time. I think they should expand, update and repopulate the existing parks because the MK essentially sees double the crowds of the other parks. They need another park that demands that much attention whether that's an existing park or a new one. Right now I don't think Epcot has a chance at this, nor does AK. The addition of SWGE is going to make a dent in the next few years, but I don't think it has enough capacity and attractions to bring the park from 10-12M to 18-20M+.

DHS is going to need another SWGE type of land (Marvel Land if they actually hate the rights to it) to get that many people going to the park every day consistently over time. Many people hit up MK twice in a vacation, DHS is going to need more to get people to go twice.

That's why the "dream" of a fifth gate is always around. Disney truly does not have a second 2-day park like MK and I don't think you'll be able to get that out of AK and Epcot no matter what kind of additions you make.

A lot of that has to do with the classics rides being there, the castle, Main Street, etc. MK is just quintessential Disney. No matter how many new rides or other parks you make, I think MK will be the leading park for a long long long time. But you could certainly make any of the other park 2-day parks with the right investment, IPs, and a lot of time.
 
You have to believe that WDW has something planned for the future. They just purchased 965 acres on the other side of I4. That frees up a lot of space around the theme parks that can be taken out of wetlands (as this new purchase is supposedly going to stay as wetlands) and put into developement. Whether that is park expansion, more hotels, or another park. They just greatly increased their options.
 
I've been thinking about this for a while and considered many possible reasons for all the new resort construction . A 5th Park to me seems like the only likely reason for all this new construction . I know Star Wars Galaxies Edge is going to be hugely popular and the reason many will suggest as the primary reason for all this resort expansion ...but I don't believe that it will be popular to the extent that Disney feels they can fill all these new rooms year round because of it . I believe that because of the coming 3rd Park that Universal has planned (though not yet announced) Disney has been planning a multilevel multi-year expansion to combat Universal's aggressive attempts to capture more of Disney's market share . Updating , upgrading , renovating , and expanding all the existing parks at an unprecedented pace shows that Disney is taking Universal's growth as a real threat to their kingdom and will fight back any and all ways to maintain their supremacy in the theme park industry . Building new resorts and a 5th theme park as well seem like another way Disney can and probably will secure their number 1 status in Orlando for the foreseeable future .
As much as I agree and think a 5th park is necessary.....I'm pessimistic! Pandora was a 12 acre land addition with 2 attractions and that was over $500 million. A new 100+ acre park with a dozen attractions and a few restaurants would be $6-8 Billion...minimum. Thats quite a chuck for Disney to lay out! I think Toy Story and Star Wars lands are Disneys pre-emtive strike at Universals 3rd gate.
 
Many good points made here but I still believe that we will see a 5th park open in WDW within the next 10 years . Until then they will complete projects in HS , EP , and perhaps an expansion at AK of Pandora (or perhaps a reimagined Dinoland area or Zootopia land created ) . Obviously Disney has no shortage of IP's to create attractions from or lands around . Universals continued expansion have necessitated Disney making unprecedented upgrades , expansions , and changes that probably wouldn't have happened without . Certainly not anywhere close to this scale .
 
Many good points made here but I still believe that we will see a 5th park open in WDW within the next 10 years . Until then they will complete projects in HS , EP , and perhaps an expansion at AK of Pandora (or perhaps a reimagined Dinoland area or Zootopia land created ) . Obviously Disney has no shortage of IP's to create attractions from or lands around . Universals continued expansion have necessitated Disney making unprecedented upgrades , expansions , and changes that probably wouldn't have happened without . Certainly not anywhere close to this scale .
The difference between Uni Disney is universal can increase their market share with another park, whereas Disney is going to eat more into their existing audience more than anything else. I just can’t see another Disney park happening in the next 20 years, unless American vacation time is drastically increased
 
Many good points made here but I still believe that we will see a 5th park open in WDW within the next 10 years . Until then they will complete projects in HS , EP , and perhaps an expansion at AK of Pandora (or perhaps a reimagined Dinoland area or Zootopia land created ) . Obviously Disney has no shortage of IP's to create attractions from or lands around . Universals continued expansion have necessitated Disney making unprecedented upgrades , expansions , and changes that probably wouldn't have happened without . Certainly not anywhere close to this scale .
If that was the case early stage prep work and rumors would be spreading. Theme parks take years and year to be built these days.
 
If that was the case early stage prep work and rumors would be spreading. Theme parks take years and year to be built these days.
I believe animal kingdom was in prep stages in the early 90s and opened in 98? Just trying to think of a recent example
 
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