Davids DVC: Rental reimbursement or rescheduling?

Maistre Gracey

DIS Veteran
Joined
Apr 23, 2002
I’m blown away by how many people don’t seem to understand they OWN the timeshare.
If my car breaks down I’m out the use of the car for a week. If I rented the car I’m out nothing.
 

Sandisw

DVC Forums
Moderator
Joined
Nov 15, 2008
I missed the "only accept reservations from owners who are early in their UY" check box on David's application page.

If you know better than to hold your points till the end of your UY, isn't it unethical to transfer that onto an unknowing renter?
Not really because in all situations other than a resort closure...which wasn’t really addressed in these contracts...these reservations are not able to be canceled or changeable by the renter.

It is the resorts being closed that is the issue for expiring points
 
  • TCRAIG

    Member Since 2010 SS/OKW/HH/BCV/WLV/BLT/GF
    Joined
    Jun 17, 2011
    Just interested how many owners would be as firm on their "No refunds" stance if they had their own vacation during this time period and Disney told them they wouldn't return their points or if they did and expired before the resorts re-opened.
    Isn’t that just what Disney is doing by not returning banked/borrowed points -
    Whether I rented them out or use myself - those points will be gone...
     

    Matty B13

    DIS Veteran
    Joined
    Jun 13, 2016
    I’m blown away by how many people don’t seem to understand they OWN the timeshare.
    If my car breaks down I’m out the use of the car for a week. If I rented the car I’m out nothing.
    I think AirBnB is a better example, because I don’t think Enterprise or Alamo rent out cars from a third party. But even then, usually the person who is renting the reservation actually owns and controls the property.

    I’m wondering if over on Tugs if their having the same debates, or have examples of this happening before???

    Makes me also wonder if a DVC resort had a huge fire, and was taken out of service for 6+ months how DVC would handle that?
     

    Maistre Gracey

    DIS Veteran
    Joined
    Apr 23, 2002
    I think AirBnB is a better example, because I don’t think Enterprise or Alamo rent out cars from a third party. But even then, usually the person who is renting the reservation actually owns and controls the property.

    I’m wondering if over on Tugs if their having the same debates, or have examples of this happening before???

    Makes me also wonder if a DVC resort had a huge fire, and was taken out of service for 6+ months how DVC would handle that?
    I’m not sure I follow the first part. If I rent from Alamo and the car breaks down, I just get another car.
    Or, if they have no more cars, as a renter I will get a refund.
     

    TheWheel

    Earning My Ears
    Joined
    May 2, 2019
    I sort of touched on this topic in another thread. It appears that DVC has been returning points to owners whose reservations have been impacted by closure. However, some of these points now have limited "shelf life" and so far DVC hasn't granted any exception to extend them. Hence, are owners supposed to absorb these losses?

    As I mention earlier, if DVC/Disney is willing to help owners (no guarantee at this point), then I think they should be more flexible with renters. Other than that, why should the owners be burdened with the risks associated with using those points, which are supposed to be transferred to renters.

    I think I have read in another thread that someone brought up an analogy about someone selling gift certificates for a restaurant to another person at a discount. When that restaurant goes out of business before the gift certificates can be redeemed, should the person who purchased the certificates be reimbursed by the person who sold them?

    LAX
    Because they are the owner and cannot transfer the points, only offer the accommodations which they cannot provide. Using your restaurant analogy, if you made a reservation for a restaurant that required you pay in advance but upon arrival the restaurant is closed. Do they get to keep your money?
     

    Sandisw

    DVC Forums
    Moderator
    Joined
    Nov 15, 2008
    Isn’t that just what Disney is doing by not returning banked/borrowed points -
    Whether I rented them out or use myself - those points will be gone...
    Disney is returning points but read how many owners want the rules of the contract to be ignored and allow banking beyond deadline or to have banked points banked again.

    There is definitely a different mindset from owners who have their own vacations canceled and stand to lose points vs, owners who feel renters are out of luck if a new reservation cant be figured out
     

    Sandisw

    DVC Forums
    Moderator
    Joined
    Nov 15, 2008
    I think AirBnB is a better example, because I don’t think Enterprise or Alamo rent out cars from a third party. But even then, usually the person who is renting the reservation actually owns and controls the property.

    I’m wondering if over on Tugs if their having the same debates, or have examples of this happening before???

    Makes me also wonder if a DVC resort had a huge fire, and was taken out of service for 6+ months how DVC would handle that?
    Based on the terms of the actual contract we signed, my understanding of it is that we would be out of luck unless there was some insurance settlement that would be used to cover losses,

    Anything DVCM does to change terms of points, is not required. They do not have to as they have an obligation to keep the system in balance and that is part of the contract,

    Think of it as the debate here, Owners believe that since there is a contract with a no refunds or change clause, they aren’t required to do it, but are helping renters,

    Changes being made for owners is being done out of goodwill, not that it is legally required.
     

    Matty B13

    DIS Veteran
    Joined
    Jun 13, 2016
    Based on the terms of the actual contract we signed, my understanding of it is that we would be out of luck unless there was some insurance settlement that would be used to cover losses,

    Anything DVCM does to change terms of points, is not required. They do not have to as they have an obligation to keep the system in balance and that is part of the contract,

    Think of it as the debate here, Owners believe that since there is a contract with a no refunds or change clause, they aren’t required to do it, but are helping renters,

    Changes being made for owners is being done out of goodwill, not that it is legally required.
    That is why I think after this mess has been settled, that DVC should come out with a "clear" policy in case another event like this happens, and the policy could be referenced an any rental agreement as well. That way Owners & Renters know exactly how things will be handled, and are not waiting/wanting pixie dust to happen.
     

    Sandisw

    DVC Forums
    Moderator
    Joined
    Nov 15, 2008
    That is why I think after this mess has been settled, that DVC should come out with a "clear" policy in case another event like this happens, and the policy could be referenced an any rental agreement as well. That way Owners & Renters know exactly how things will be handled, and are not waiting/wanting pixie dust to happen.
    It would be nice, but there is always pixie dust given, just never been for this mass scale. So, I do think we could have some flexibility but when there is a closure like this,IMO, rules should be followed, other than holding.

    As an owner who may rent in the future, i know for sure it would be clear what is going to happen. Though, after this, just not sure I want to.
     

    McCrae

    DIS Veteran
    Joined
    Aug 29, 2009
    I agree with everything you mentioned above. We have been to WDW 5-6 times in the last 17 years but have always stayed in moderates and values. We always had trip insurance and never needed to file a claim. We have a split stay (2 contracts) for 10 days in early May that we rented 11 months ago. This is our first time renting and we are celebrating our 30th anniversary and my daughter's college graduation. I have already lost thousands of dollars because my other's daughter's study abroad was cut short and her trip insurance didn't cover the expenses. Now I am close to losing thousands more because of renting DVC. Even if they are willing to reschedule or refund our money, I will not put ourselves in this situation again and make sure my family and friends are also aware that renting can be extremely risky (added: unless contracts are different or trip insurances start covering these situations).
    Good trip insurance already exists that covers this type of event.
     

    McCrae

    DIS Veteran
    Joined
    Aug 29, 2009
    That is why I think after this mess has been settled, that DVC should come out with a "clear" policy in case another event like this happens, and the policy could be referenced an any rental agreement as well. That way Owners & Renters know exactly how things will be handled, and are not waiting/wanting pixie dust to happen.
    I think people will be advised to get more comprehensive insurance. Coverage is available for this, most people probably not aware of it, others maybe decided not to pay the additional premium.
     

    McCrae

    DIS Veteran
    Joined
    Aug 29, 2009
    Because they are the owner and cannot transfer the points, only offer the accommodations which they cannot provide. Using your restaurant analogy, if you made a reservation for a restaurant that required you pay in advance but upon arrival the restaurant is closed. Do they get to keep your money?
    Points can be transferred for example to RCI Where alternative holidays can be taken.
     

    McCrae

    DIS Veteran
    Joined
    Aug 29, 2009
    I’m blown away by how many people don’t seem to understand they OWN the timeshare.
    If my car breaks down I’m out the use of the car for a week. If I rented the car I’m out nothing.
    It’s not as clear as that. Owners are paid for points, not length stay at a resort.
     

    Bearval

    Mouseketeer
    Joined
    Dec 31, 2017
    I am willing to bet some owners may wind up in small claims court if they do not reimburse renters their money. It is relatively cheap to do and does not require a lawyer. It will determine if the language in the contract is actually binding. If the owner of the points does not show up for the hearing date you lose.
     

    McCrae

    DIS Veteran
    Joined
    Aug 29, 2009
    Not really because in all situations other than a resort closure...which wasn’t really addressed in these contracts...these reservations are not able to be canceled or changeable by the renter.

    It is the resorts being closed that is the issue for expiring points
    I expect that very few renters take out any insurance and even fewer will have a policy that would cover this. I have an annual insurance policy for travel that doesn’t cover this, but if I had asked at the time of taking the policy out cover could have been arranged.
     

    McCrae

    DIS Veteran
    Joined
    Aug 29, 2009
    I am willing to bet some owners may wind up in small claims court if they do not reimburse renters their money. It is relatively cheap to do and does not require a lawyer. It will determine if the language in the contract is actually binding. If the owner of the points does not show up for the hearing date you lose.
    You are probably right, the question would be how is any judgement enforced, especially with owners from different states or even countries are involved. A renter could easily end up paying more to cover court costs and just be further out of pocket.
     

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