Day 2 – London
Sat. July 8, 2017
Finished Tour / Hotel Return
(weather – sunny high 77 °F / 25 °C)
A strange journey to the Underground continues........
So where were we? Right. Still in London.
Evan Evans just dropped the rest of us off right in the middle of a major roadway at NH Kensington Hotel.
And now we’re on foot looking for the Earl’s Court Underground station,
(This is actually where we are walking, which really isn’t that far once you retrace our steps)
Finally JQ notices a sign up ahead.
We arrive at Earl’s Court Station
Walk in – and this is what you’ll see
Welcome to London Transportation 102: Practice vs Theory
It's one thing to read about London's transport system. It's quite another to have it spontaneously thrown at you and be forced to use it.
We were completely unprepared for this.
Catching a commuter train is like participating in a fire drill. With everyone coming and going so fast, you can’t help but get caught up in a false sense of urgency.
5 things rush at us at once:
A: Where to?
B: Which ticket to buy?
C: What method of payment to use?
D: How to hop the right line?
E: Hurry – don’t miss the next train!
The last one - Letter E - was
our biggest downfall. If you can eliminate that from dominating your thought process, you will manage the Underground successfully with ease and control.
If you can’t – you will make rookie mistakes like we did!
Ok. Let’s go ride the tube.
(I’ll address each area individually)
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1. Where to?
No problem. (Charlotte already told us)
Earl’s Court to LHR =
blue line (Piccadilly) on the tube map.
Map Legend:
Red Arrows - Evan Evans drop off locations
Red Star - London Heathrow Airport
Other points of interest:
Black Dots - Paddington and Victoria Stations
Home to the only 2 Airport Express Rail Lines specifically as follows:
- Heathrow Express – nonstop service between Paddington & LHR
- Gatwick Express – nonstop service between Victoria & Gatwick Airport
(remember: these trains do not accept the Oyster Card)
Orange Triangles - Location of the only 3 London trains to Dover
St Pancreas (the express speed rail) / Victoria (direct mon-sat) / Charing Cross to London Bridge
(trains to Dover Priory Station also do not accept the Oyster Card)
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FYI: For anyone considering the train to Dover – (
@JenTen1585 did this)
Here’s a helpful link:
https://www.londontoolkit.com/travel/dover_train.htm
With this easy to follow chart.
That wasn’t too bad.
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2. Which ticket to buy?
(This is where it starts to get complicated)
Every site_Every video_Every person -
recommends you buy an Oyster Card or get the Visitor Oyster Card mailed in advance.
Put down a £5.00 refundable deposit and “top it off” with travel funds and you can tap and go all trip.
It’s easy to use / convenient / linked to multiple transportation options in and around London / and has a daily cap.
Even Rick Steves makes it all seem so simple
Plus - the fares charged on the Oyster are far cheaper than the cost of a daily paper ticket.
What’s not to love?
Take our trip for example: traveling Sat. July 8, 2017
Earl’s Court (zones 1 & 2) Piccadilly Line to LHR terminal 5 (zone 6)
Oyster -
Peak: £2.80 - Monday to Friday from 0630 to 0930 and from 1600 to 1900.
Off Peak: £1.50 - At all other times including public holidays.
vs.
Day Ticket (cash) - £5.90 – At any time.
So 3 tix on Sat. (for us) = £4.50 Oyster vs £17.70 cash.
Sounds like a no brainer. Save £13.20 and Get the Oyster card – right?
Not so fast.
Should we really commit to an Oyster card in our situation?
This will be the 1 and only time we will ever ride the tube and all we need is a 1 way trip back to LHR right now. We leave for a cruise in the morning, and immediately fly to NYC from Gatwick when we return back to Dover.
Answer: Not Necessarily
Ideally, and with proper planning, we would have avoided this whole Oyster card debate completely and hopped the Heathrow Express back from the Evan Evans tour.
Just pre-purchase one-way weekend tickets online 90 days in advance at a flat rate of £5.50/each and beeline back to the airport in 15 mins on an express rail.
All we had to do was talk Charlotte into dropping us at Paddington.
This would have been an independent ticket purchase for
£16.50 (they don’t accept the Oyster card) and saved us more than a 45 min. commute on a regional rail.
Well worth the price.
But this only saves you money if you buy in advance. Otherwise, a last minute ticket runs £22.00/pp - each way.
Unfortunately, that never happened and we are not at Paddington Station.
We are at Earl’s Court
Standing in front of these ticket machines.
Faced with a 1+ hr commute ahead of us on the Piccadilly Line to get back to LHR, and having to decide between two purchase options:
Oyster Card or Day Ticket?
No time to figure which is better at this point, so we buy day tickets.
Which I’m sure makes no sense to anyone doing the math:
Option A: Oyster Card (3 adults)
3 x Oyster card (£5.00 deposit/card) £15.00
3 x pay as you go credit (£5.00 min/card)
+ £15.00
Amount paid at machine = £30.00
Deduct: Card Activity for our trip
3 x 1-way Earl’s Court to LHR (£1.50/ticket) =
(£ 4.50) (offpeak /wknd)
Refund Due: Unused pay as you go funds + deposit on cards = £25.50 (£8.50/card)
Option B: Day (paper) Tickets
3 x 1-way Earl’s Court to LHR (£5.90 / ticket)
= £17.70 Amount paid at machine
No Refund Due
So there it is. Proof we would definitely have saved £13.20 with the Oyster card - (£17.70 day ticket vs £4.50 oyster) Right?
Wrong.
The only way we save £13.20 is if we actually get the £25.50 on the cards refunded
The minute we fail to receive that money back, we will have wasted £12.30 more for Oyster cards vs. paper tickets. (£17.70 cash vs £30.00 Oyster)
Which is exactly why we bought paper tickets.
Article after article / video after video will keep telling you how to get the Oyster card_how to use the Oyster card_how to fund the Oyster card and so on.
Yet none of them tells you how to get the funds back once you’re done with the Oyster card.
That's probably because getting unused funds and deposit money refunded from an Oyster card is not as easy as you might think.
So Buyer Beware!
READ THIS BEFORE YOU PURCHASE
Oyster Card : How to get a refund - (last updated 25 April 2017)
https://www.toptiplondon.com/transport/tickets/oyster-card/oyster-card-refunds
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Oyster Card Refunds
The £5 deposit you pay for an Oyster card is refundable along with any Pay as you go money left on the card.
Before you claim a refund, it’s worth bearing in mind that if you’ve used your Oyster card on a Pay as you go basis and it’s not loaded with a weekly Travelcard or bus pass then it’s transferable. And the money doesn’t expire so you can give it to a friend, relative or anyone else to use.
If you don’t know anyone who might want to use an Oyster or you don’t plan to return to London, you can get back any unused money.
Where to get a refund in London
If you’ve registered your Oyster card online with TfL, refunds are available online.
Once you get a refund you will longer be able to use the Oyster card.
£5 deposit and up to £10 of Pay as you go money
If you haven’t registered you card, your
£5 deposit and up to £10 of Pay as you go money can be refunded at underground (tube) station ticket machines 48 hours after purchasing your card.
Oyster refunds at Heathrow airport
At Heathrow airport you can get a refund if you have £10 of pay as you go money or less on your card and your £5 deposit from:
- the ticket machines in Terminals 1,2,3 underground station
- the ticket machines Terminal 4 underground station
- the ticket office in Terminal 5 underground station. Refunds are not available from Heathrow Terminal 5 ticket machine
- the Express train & underground ticket desk in Terminal 5 arrivals
The refund will be in cash.
If you have
more than £10 of pay as you go money on your card, refunds might be available from the TfL Visitor Centre. This is just outside the Terminal 1,2 & 3 underground station. It’s open daily from 7am to 8.30pm.
If you paid for and topped up your Oyster with a credit or debit card, you can get a refund credited to your card instead of cash. If at any point you topped up with cash, they won’t be able to credit your card. The refund will be in cash.
It’s easy to walk to Terminal 2 or 3 from the Visitor Centre. If you’re leaving from Terminal 4 or 5, follow the signs for Heathrow Express and take the free train transfer.
Oyster refunds at Gatwick Airport
It’s not possible to get a refund on any Pay as you go money at Gatwick Airport. The £5 deposit is refundable at the National Rail desk near arrivals in the South Terminal (not the train station ticket offices).
How to get a refund after leaving London
If you can’t visit an underground station before you leave, contact TfL Customer Services on 0343 222 1234 (open daily 8am–8pm).
Or, send your Oyster card and photocopied proof of name and address to TfL:
Oyster Refunds
4th Floor
14 Pier Walk
North Greenwich
London
SE10 0ES
Refunds by post will be sent by cheque (£) or by bank transfer to your bank accounts (UK addresses only).
How to get a refund after leaving the UK
If you live outside the UK, it’s still possible to get a refund but you need to telephone TfL Customer services on +44 343 222 1234.
Last updated: 25 April 2017
Honestly, it’s a good thing we didn’t buy them. After reading the requirements on how to get the unused funds back, it’s clear we would have failed.
For us, the Oyster Card was not worth it.
Too many hurdles to overcome – particularly at the Heathrow airport.
(and Gatwick will only give you the deposit money back - no unused travel funds)
You can't use the ticket machines for Oyster refunds at Heathrow. Must visit the ticket windows during regular operating hours.
You must wait 48hrs from the issuance of the card to use a ticket machine for a refund.
The ticket machines dispense in coin. (which you can't exchange at a US bank)
You can’t get a check issued to the US.
You can't get a refund from a machine or ticket window if you have more than £10 of unused travel funds on the card. - you must call
And contacting TfL Customer Service comes with no guarantees, plus they charge a £5 administration fee to process a refund.
Again, not worth the time and effort here.
So you really have to weigh all the facts.
Paper Tickets it is!
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C. What method of payment to use?
(This is not necessarily a slam dunk either)
There was a discussion early on in our cruise meet thread about needing a pin number for credit cards with a chip in Europe.
@BadPinkTink confirmed that a “chip and pin” was required for card readers.
It starts here:
https://www.disboards.com/threads/d...uise-from-dover.3515878/page-17#post-57677019
So this was a big concern for those of us from the US where pin numbers aren’t issued or required for credit card purchases. How do we use a credit card in the UK that doesn’t have a pin number?
The quick answer was: That a sales person knows how to handle US credit cards and can bypass the pin at the register.
But you could run into a situation where that option might not be available.
The best example given was at an automated ticket machine. What if using these machines becomes your only option because there isn’t a ticket window/agent on hand at that location?
And what if that particular location doesn't have the machines that accept bills (only coins)?
or what if you don't happen to have any UK cash on you and have to use your bank card?
And they all require a pin number to use that bank card?
Here's a really great article by Rick Steves regarding pin cards:
https://www.ricksteves.com/travel-tips/money/chip-pin-cards
The Low-Down on Chip-and-PIN Cards in Europe
When Europeans buy something with plastic, they insert their card, then type in their PIN.
By Rick Steves
Europe — and the rest of the world — uses a system for credit and debit cards that differs a bit from ours (yes, even from our new chip-embedded cards). This fact has caused some anxiety among American travelers, but really: Don't worry. While I've been inconvenienced a few times by self-service payment machines that wouldn't accept my old-style, magnetic-stripe card, it's never caused me any serious trouble. Any American card will work at hotels, restaurants, and shops as long as there's a cashier.
How chip-and-PIN cards work: European credit-card readers work on a chip-and-PIN verification system. To make a purchase, the cardholder inserts the card into a slot in the payment machine, then enters a PIN while the card stays in the slot. The chip inside the card authorizes the transaction; the cardholder doesn't sign a receipt. You've probably seen similar machines at home, as most major US banks now offer credit cards with chips.
How US chip cards are different: The chip cards being rolled out in the US are generally chip-and-signature cards, for which your signature verifies your identity. For the most part, American cards — especially ones with embedded chips — work fine in Europe. Since our cards are designed to work on a signature-verification system, some European card readers automatically generate a receipt for you to sign, just as you would at home. American chip-and-signature cards also work at plenty of self-service machines, including those in the Paris Métro and London Underground.
Tips for using your US card at payment terminals in Europe: Some payment machines may prompt you to enter your PIN. Because you might run into this, it's important to contact your bank well before your trip to request your card's PIN (if your bank says the PIN is only for cash withdrawals, ask for it anyway). Be sure to allow time to receive your PIN by mail.
Even armed with an chip card and a PIN, you may still hit some bumps in the road. US chip-and-signature cards are not configured for offline transactions (in which the card is securely validated without a real-time connection to the bank). This is a common hassle at unmanned payment terminals, such as Dutch train ticket machines, French toll plazas, and out-of-the-way Swiss gas stations.
If a self-service payment machine won't accept your card, look for a cashier nearby who can process your card manually. (For this reason, it's a good idea to allow a little extra time at train stations and the like, as staffed service windows almost always have longer lines than ticket machines.) Since most payment machines take cash, it's also smart to keep spare change handy in case there's no cashier nearby (for highway toll booths, parking garages, luggage lockers, bike-rental kiosks, etc.).
Drivers in particular need to be aware of potential problems when filling up at an unattended gas station, entering a parking garage, or exiting a toll road. Be prepared to move on to the next gas station if necessary (don't let your tank get too low, especially if driving at night or on a Sunday). In a pinch, you could ask a local if you can pay them cash to run a transaction on their card. When approaching a toll plaza, err on the easier (if slower) side by using the "cash only" lane.
Finding a true chip-and-PIN card: If you're concerned, ask if your bank offers a true chip-and-PIN card that will work at offline payment terminals.
Andrews Federal Credit Union and the
State Department Federal Credit Union offer these cards with low fees and are open to all US residents (though you may need to jump through a few hoops to join). Some banks may also offer true chip-and-PIN cards, but verify your card's status carefully to make sure it'll work offline (and that its overseas-transaction fees aren't unreasonable). For a helpful overview of US chip cards, see
us-emv-cards.silk.co.
Turns out we were able to request pin numbers for our VISA credit cards (incl. Capital One), just in case we needed them. It took a few weeks to arrive by mail in secret so plan accordingly. We had them among our papers and kept them securely locked up in the safe at the Sofitel.
So of course we forget to grab them before we left for Stonehenge this morning.
And no - we did not memorize these pin numbers or record them in a smart phone.
There was 1 exception: American Express. They informed us that they only issue pin numbers for cash withdrawals on your card - which ours did not have.
We asked what to do in the event a pin was needed for an overseas purchase? They said to just use the 4 digit code on the front of the card.
Now that was easy to remember!
Sure enough we were prompted for a pin number to use our cc at the underground ticket machine. And the AMEX 4 digit number on the face of the card was accepted.
Here's a video showing that use of a bankcard at an underground ticket machine will require a pin. (note she’s topping up funds on an Oyster card here)
So make sure you have what you need to make bankcard purchases in the UK.
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continued.....................
I'm confused though... the tour company wouldn't take you back to the Victoria Coach Station? I was hoping to use a tour guide that would pick up and drop off near the Victoria station since I plan to stay within walking distance.
