I heard that the Grand Floridian was over-sold, yes/no?

This.

My VGF points are for VGF. When it comes to pass that I have the cash to buy say BWV or BCV for spring birthday trips or Flower and Garden then I will do so. I might take a hard look at SSR for our Spring trips. But our VGF is for our fall trips and will only be used for VGF.

I guess what I did is the same result. I took a transfer at a different resort and rented out my VGF points. However, I rented them out to someone who wanted to stay at VGF only, so it was the same result of using my VGF points for VGF.
 
Yep. This is what I;ve said of resale buyers of BWV and BCV, and I think it's true of VGF buyers in resale as well. The contracts are harder to find and more costly. You don't go and buy those to play resort roulette.
 
DIS readers are a very very small percentage of DVC active folks and even a smaller percentage of those who are buying VGF and even a smaller percentage of those will take the time to post.

Here's our experience as VGF owners:
We have never had trouble booking at VGF. We bought enough points to stay in a 1 BR for 8-10 nights every other year (we own a similar bunch of points at BCV). We have stayed twice at VGF since purchasing: once for 10 nights during flower and garden and once for 9 nights during food and wine. I didn't have any problem booking our room either time but again we book the 1 bedroom AND I book it immediately at 11 months when the window is open long enough for me to book the whole trip online (so not at exactly 11 months but a few days after the window opens).

As a side note, I do the same at BCV in terms of booking and have never had a problem getting our room for F&W. The only time I had trouble was when I wanted to add a few days on at the 9 month mark to our original reservation. There was no BCV availability so we did a split stay at the Garden Cottages at BW.

We love VGF - the restaurants, the location, being able to walk to Poly and the TCC, monorail to TOTWL. We have very different trips when we stay at BCV vs VGF in terms of where we eat, where we pop in, what park we spontaneously drop in to, etc.
 
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Here's our experience as VGF owners:
We have never had trouble booking at VGF. We bought enough points to stay in a 1 BR for 8-10 nights every other year (we own a similar bunch of points at BCV). We have stayed twice at VGF since purchasing: once for 10 nights during flower and garden and once for 9 nights during food and wine. I didn't have any problem booking our room either time but again we book the 1 bedroom AND I book it immediately at 11 months when the window is open long enough for me to book the whole trip online (so not at exactly 11 months but a few days after the window opens).

As a side note, I do the same at BCV in terms of booking and have never had a problem getting our room for F&W. The only time I had trouble was when I wanted to add a few days on at the 9 month mark to our original reservation. There was no BCV availability so we did a split stay at the Garden Cottages at BW.

We love VGF - the restaurants, the location, being able to walk to Poly and the TCC, monorail to TOTWL. We have very different trips when we stay at BCV vs VGF in terms of where we eat, where we pop in, what park we spontaneously drop in to, etc.
Out of curiosity how many points do you have there for 8-10 days every other year? Was wondering how many days a 1br would take there for a week every other year across different seasons. Guessing around 150.
 
Out of curiosity how many points do you have there for 8-10 days every other year? Was wondering how many days a 1br would take there for a week every other year across different seasons. Guessing around 150.

We have 200 which is a bit more than we need so I am able to bank. We don't go over holidays, spring break, or in the summer because of the crowds so we need less points than if we went in busy seasons
 


I heard anecdotally that the VGF oversold DVC shares, is this the case? Any of you have this as a home resort and struggle to book 11 mos out? Thanks!
I say this with all due respect, but if you think that it is possible that DVC "oversold" this resort then you probably don't have a firm understanding of how the DVC system works. While there are clear challenges to booking that have been well described in this thread, I would also suggest that you take the time to fully research the mechanics of DVC to determine if it is a system that will work for you.
 
I keep saying it... for resort roulette at non peak times, enough SSR points for a 1 bed is all you need and it isn't changing anytime soon.
 
I keep saying it... for resort roulette at non peak times, enough SSR points for a 1 bed is all you need and it isn't changing anytime soon.
If you're OK missing standard/value view options and trying various resorts over time, I agree. Frankly, I think this is workable for all bed types if you want to try things over time and even for the higher demand times. But it does require more stress, uncertainty and effort than some are willing to endure. There may be a few things that are going to not be workable with this approach but if you eliminate the things that are a problem even at 11 months if you own there, not a lot.
 
If you're OK missing standard/value view options and trying various resorts over time, I agree. Frankly, I think this is workable for all bed types if you want to try things over time and even for the higher demand times. But it does require more stress, uncertainty and effort than some are willing to endure. There may be a few things that are going to not be workable with this approach but if you eliminate the things that are a problem even at 11 months if you own there, not a lot.
Agree. When I go though there is no stress as the 1 bed is almost 100% guaranteed to be open and I just book at 7 months. So I'm going next July but haven't bothered booking at 11 to switch, no point. IF however I was trying the same tactic at peak times, I'd have booked my SSR at 11 and on 7 months be logging on to try and switch, then waitlist, and stalking etc. Then the stress could go up as even if you get it at 7 months it' not virtually guaranteed as it is in off peak.
One day I'll go in peak but I won't have stress as my expectations will change. I bought where I wouldn't mind staying, which is SSR. If something else came up on 7, like it could, great, but I'd not have any expectation or disappointment if it didn't.
I researched all this in great detail and knew exactly what to expect and what my tactics were before I bought in. So far it's working exactly as intended so I am delighted with the product as it fits my needs exactly, at a very good price.
Not sure I'd buy points for a studio for this tactic. As you say Dean, it can be done off peak but chances in a studio decrease significantly from 'almost guaranteed' to 'maybe'. The stress/ hassle factor which doesn't exist now would creep in.
 
Agree. When I go though there is no stress as the 1 bed is almost 100% guaranteed to be open and I just book at 7 months. So I'm going next July but haven't bothered booking at 11 to switch, no point. IF however I was trying the same tactic at peak times, I'd have booked my SSR at 11 and on 7 months be logging on to try and switch, then waitlist, and stalking etc. Then the stress could go up as even if you get it at 7 months it' not virtually guaranteed as it is in off peak.
One day I'll go in peak but I won't have stress as my expectations will change. I bought where I wouldn't mind staying, which is SSR. If something else came up on 7, like it could, great, but I'd not have any expectation or disappointment if it didn't.
I researched all this in great detail and knew exactly what to expect and what my tactics were before I bought in. So far it's working exactly as intended so I am delighted with the product as it fits my needs exactly, at a very good price.
Not sure I'd buy points for a studio for this tactic. As you say Dean, it can be done off peak but chances in a studio decrease significantly from 'almost guaranteed' to 'maybe'. The stress/ hassle factor which doesn't exist now would creep in.
Stress is self generated, I don't sweat it either, most of my stays are on exchanges so significantly more savings and far less certainty but it works for me. And most of the time when I have used my points myself, I've ended up using the wait list to some degree including piecing together a standard view wait list for 7 nights in a BWV standard view studio before Xmas last year. As I said, anything that's not difficult at 11 months out day one is possible 7 months out, anything, but some will be more difficult and less likely than others. And things change over time, there may come a time when this isn't the case. In large part the new resort may define that issue, esp since I'm inclined to think it's demand long term will be less than the average at WDW though more than SSR/OKW/AKV.
 
In large part the new resort may define that issue, esp since I'm inclined to think it's demand long term will be less than the average at WDW though more than SSR/OKW/AKV.

I think the success of the Riviera Resort will depend on two factor: points chart and the gondola system. I don't think that given the location they can charge per night a number of points in the range of the Poly or VGF. If they have a standard and fireworks views in the region of SSR standard and preferred, and if the gondola system turns out efficient (i.e. no more than 5-10 minutes to get aboard), then this resort could be above average demand.
Bu we can count on Disney being greedy and spoil it.
 
I don't think that given the location they can charge per night a number of points in the range of the Poly or VGF.

Wishful thinking. It'll be at the current going rate is when it opens, which will be the same as CCV and PVB are selling for now plus the annual price increases (and minus any incentive promo they run at the time). Heck, they keep raising Aulani despite taking so long to sell. I'm sure there will be plenty of demand for a new resort adjacent to EC and DHS.
 
Wishful thinking. It'll be at the current going rate is when it opens, which will be the same as CCV and PVB are selling for now plus the annual price increases (and minus any incentive promo they run at the time). Heck, they keep raising Aulani despite taking so long to sell. I'm sure there will be plenty of demand for a new resort adjacent to EC and DHS.
I think @zavandor was more referring to "points per night." Note that CCV cabins are cheaper (points per night) than bungalows. The points themselves are at current $$$, but the points-per-room for CCV was kept in line with BRV. So the hope is that Riviera rooms cost less than VGF rooms, which are pretty pricey for points per night.
 
I think @zavandor was more referring to "points per night." Note that CCV cabins are cheaper (points per night) than bungalows. The points themselves are at current $$$, but the points-per-room for CCV was kept in line with BRV. So the hope is that Riviera rooms cost less than VGF rooms, which are pretty pricey for points per night.
This was my train of thought when the "moderate" DVC concept was discussed. The only way to have "balance" would be to price the points in-line with the current direct pricing. The "moderate" aspect could be achieved through a lower point structure...charging 8-12 points per night in a studio. This would achieve three things:
  1. It would appeal to the "middle class" of prospective DVC buyers. A studio that averages, say, 80 points per week would mean families could buy in at a modest $13-$14K and still be able to go for one week per year in a studio.
  2. By keeping the buy-in cost in-line with the "deluxe" resorts, and not pricing them more "moderately", they would avoid people buying in low and using the points elsewhere...
  3. ...and on the flip side, the lower points-per-night structure would be appealing to point-misers, thus keeping the demand high, even at 7 months, and eventually "requiring" the 11-month window.
The biggest downside is the decreased income potential for DVD due to a lower-point requirement...less points required = less points that they can sell.

**I forgot to add that I don't believe that the Riviera will be billed or marketed as a moderate-level DVC...probably quite the opposite. I think the discussion of a moderate DVC was initiated when the rumor of building at the CBR, a moderate hotel, was first leaked.
 
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I think the success of the Riviera Resort will depend on two factor: points chart and the gondola system. I don't think that given the location they can charge per night a number of points in the range of the Poly or VGF. If they have a standard and fireworks views in the region of SSR standard and preferred, and if the gondola system turns out efficient (i.e. no more than 5-10 minutes to get aboard), then this resort could be above average demand.
Bu we can count on Disney being greedy and spoil it.
Obviously there are a lot of variables from a demand standpoint including points charts, rooms types, room specifics, how the gondola system is implemented and perceived, resort specifics and the like. My opinion of it being of medium demand is an aggregate of my opinion on those variables. While I suspect the end point will be the same as it sounds like you do, I wouldn't call it greedy. It is their responsibility from a business standpoint to balance these issues so it sells at a sufficient speed but at the highest price and the highest points. Do I feel the potential is there to be a high end resort, yes and not. I don't feel they can reasonably get it to the level of the Monorail or EPCOT resorts but they could get it close. I don't feel the point will be as much as Poly/VGF, likely more in the range of BCV/BWV non standard or BLT. They did surprise me on the CCV coming in the same as BRV though so we'll see. Ultimately it depends on what they feel the market will bear as it should.
 
This was my train of thought when the "moderate" DVC concept was discussed. The only way to have "balance" would be to price the points in-line with the current direct pricing. The "moderate" aspect could be achieved through a lower point structure...charging 8-12 points per night in a studio. This would achieve three things:
  1. It would appeal to the "middle class" of prospective DVC buyers. A studio that averages, say, 80 points per week would mean families could buy in at a modest $13-$14K and still be able to go for one week per year in a studio.
  2. By keeping the buy-in cost in-line with the "deluxe" resorts, and not pricing them more "moderately", they would avoid people buying in low and using the points elsewhere...
  3. ...and on the flip side, the lower points-per-night structure would be appealing to point-misers, thus keeping the demand high, even at 7 months, and eventually "requiring" the 11-month window.
The biggest downside is the decreased income potential for DVD due to a lower-point requirement...less points required = less points that they can sell.

**I forgot to add that I don't believe that the Riviera will be billed or marketed as a moderate-level DVC...probably quite the opposite. I think the discussion of a moderate DVC was initiated when the rumor of building at the CBR, a moderate hotel, was first leaked.

Generally agree with you - esp wrt the " ** I forgot to add" statement at the end. :teeth:.

I don't believe the points per night will be significantly less than the "going rate". As far as CCV goes, I don't think DVD had much choice with CCV other than to match the schedule for BRV. To do otherwise would likely have noticeably depressed CCV sales IMO, Riviera will be priced & marketed as a Deluxe and the point schedule will reflect that.

As far as dues go, a lower point cost per night will mean higher dues. (Smaller total over which to spread fixes costs). I also wonder about transportation costs charged back to the resort budget. Will the Rivera need buses to DHS & EPCOT in addition to the gondolas?
 
Even if the Riviera is advertised as a moderate DVC resort (and I don't think it will be), DVC won't sell the points there for anything less the they are selling points for now.
 
Riviera will certainly be a Deluxe resort and points will be sold at whatever price points will be in 2 years.
My point is: if the point cost per night will be similar to the older resorts, (about BWV garden view on average, possibly with fireworks view costing a bit more and standard a bit less), then it will be the next best thing after BWV for convenience to reach two parks and the novelty of the gondolas. If there won't be an appeciable line to go on the gondolas, reaching Epcot or DHS would take almost the same time as by foot from BWV or BCV.
But if the price per night is more in line with Poly or VGF or if the gondola system turns out to be inefficient or a flying sauna, then demand for the resort would be much lower.
 
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