What is going on with Disney parks?

[grossmansr]

Exactly. We go now & keeping trying new strategies b/c we want DS to experience what we did. But with each failed attempt, we are more & more defeated. If this next trip doesn’t work, we will be done for awhile. So then DS ends up not growing up with that same nostalgia. I know a bunch of other families that have also reached their thresholds so it might take 20 years, but this business strategy will eventually come back to bite them imo.

This. Right here.

I still feel the nostalgia. But will my children? Disney was special because even through they are in business to make a profit, they always seemed to make a guest feel like a Guest. You might have spent plenty of money but you did it willingly and it didn't leave a bitter taste at the end of the day. Disney had a way of making each customer feel special. Valuable. Important. Even if it was just a show, it was a convincing one. It's like going to a strip club. Do the strippers really want you? The good ones make you feel like they do. Disney was like a high dollar prostitute in a sea of common whores. And she convinced us all that she really loved us.

 

[middlechild]

From the 2020 First Quarter report, found on line at: https://thewaltdisneycompany.com/app/uploads/2019/11/q4-fy19-earnings.pdf (page 4)
"Higher costs were due to new guest offerings, driven by Star Wars: Galaxy’s Edge, and the impact of wage increases for union employees."
Increasing labor costs were enough to show up on the quarterly report. While price increases certainly predate the new contract agreement, don't be fooled that Disney will not use that knowledge of new contract terms as justification to raise prices. And many will spend the extra bucks thinking they will keep some homeless waif out of sleeping in the car. And feel good about it. The new contract terms is the gift that keeps on giving too, as new minimum wage levels for the next several years means Parks and Entertainment can keep right on raising prices.

 

[Mome Rath]

Disney has become an easy target because it has become so successful... and it's become a "thing" to bash Disney on social media, as it is a big target. If it wasn't successful it would just be another closing theme park.

I still don't really get the point of trying to convince others of the value, or lack of value, of some commodity (griping about something to blow off steam fine). If a person wants that thing and can afford it, great. If a person can't afford it, then it should kind of solves itself (here's lookin' at you Porsche). If a person no longer wants that thing, and then they also want others to not want that thing, that's where it gets odd to me. It's like someone walking by a picture of Iger and drawing devil horns on 'im.

Disney making money is not a bad thing, and the company is so huge that it has to get profits in each area in order to grow each area, or else the company has to make up for one flagging area with one that is outperforming. As a Capitalist, I think that's a great thing when a company can do that and offer products that people want to consume, and in a free country everyone gets to choose if they want to trade their slips of green paper for a Disney experience or not, and yes, everyone get to choose if they want to gripe or praise.

 

[ChipnDale79]

Disney has become an easy target because it has become so successful... and it's become a "thing" to bash Disney on social media, as it is a big target. If it wasn't successful it would just be another closing theme park.

I still don't really get the point of trying to convince others of the value, or lack of value, of some commodity (griping about something to blow off steam fine). If a person wants that thing and can afford it, great. If a person can't afford it, then it should kind of solves itself (here's lookin' at you Porsche). If a person no longer wants that thing, and then they also want others to not want that thing, that's where it gets odd to me. It's like someone walking by a picture of Iger and drawing devil horns on 'im.

Disney making money is not a bad thing, and the company is so huge that it has to get profits in each area in order to grow each area, or else the company has to make up for one flagging area with one that is outperforming. As a Capitalist, I think that's a great thing when a company can do that and offer products that people want to consume, and in a free country everyone gets to choose if they want to trade their slips of green paper for a Disney experience or not, and yes, everyone get to choose if they want to gripe or praise.

I think part of it, at least for me, is that the people that will drop any amount of money to go, are putting all of us that are sick of it in a bind. Meaning, Disney isn’t going to stop the increases until people stop going to Disney like its a drug.

all of the extras that people don’t mind paying for, have a negative effect of people that are tired of the money grab.

do I miss Disney? Of course, but my wallet sure doesn’t.

it doesn’t stop until Disney feels it.

honestly, sometimes it’s nice to know that I’m not the only one that feels this way

 

[grossmansr]

If a person no longer wants that thing, and then they also want others to not want that thing, that's where it gets odd to me.

It's because people have an emotional relationship with Disney. Disney has cultivated this emotional attachment. It might be strictly business for them, but it goes much deeper for some people.

 

[disneygirlsng]

One thing that I don't understand (at least for me, probably different for others) is the comparison to other vacations. I can't get Disney when I travel other places. I go to Disney because I want Disney. That's not something I can get on just any vacation. Going on a week long trip to Italy is fantastic, I've done that too, but there's no Disney there. So for me, saying that you can spend less and go somewhere else does absolutely nothing for me, because it just can't be compared. Now if you start comparing it to going to other Disney properties across the world, then I can get on board with the comparisons.

But the other thing I have realized is not everybody has the circumstances that I do. Being single, in my late-20's, with a doctorate degree and a good paying job, while living at home with my parents, I take many vacations each year. So while a couple of those are to Disney, I am able to also go abroad, and several other places throughout the US each year as well. So I'm not having to pick and choose where I go. Which I understand is not the case for most people and is very likely impacting my viewpoint on everything. I'll gladly continue to pay for Disney, because that's what I enjoy and what makes me happy. But if rD goes away, all bets are off haha.

 

[hertamaniac]

Where is the comparison for the value resorts at Uni being Endless Summer - Surfside and Dockside? I visited them and they really bring the down the median price and are brand newish.

Cabana is spectacular. I was just there a few months ago for another visit (didn't stay) and really like the pool area/vibe. It wasn't overcrowded and the relaxation factor is through the roof.

 

[Mome Rath]

But, that's the way it is with anything a business offers; they don't keep dropping the price of a new car when people can and will pay more for the same vehicle, and I can't blame people that can afford the car for buying it if they want it. In order for that car company to stay in business, they have to keep upgrading the car and raising the price, for as long as the market will hold it.

It won't change at Disney until the whole market changes, and most of the time, if that happens we'll all be hurting because there will be something going on with the economy, illness, or war/terrorism.

The emotional attachment is a free will thing though; we don't blindly follow our emotions, we have free will in order to have self control. If we don't, we have to cultivate that (as I'm sure people know), and it's not just for vacations or primarily for vacations, but it does apply I think. And, yes, I know people are sad if they get priced out of things, but we are all (probably all) priced out of a lot of things we want. The companies that cater to those things have no obligation to me to lower their rates so I can buy those things, or take those vacations. But, I do understand trying to find others feeling the same way to share the sadness of that.

 

[Mackenzie Click-Mickelson]

One thing that I don't understand (at least for me, probably different for others) is the comparison to other vacations. I can't get Disney when I travel other places. I go to Disney because I want Disney. That's not something I can get on just any vacation. Going on a week long trip to Italy is fantastic, I've done that too, but there's no Disney there. So for me, saying that you can spend less and go somewhere else does absolutely nothing for me, because it just can't be compared. Now if you start comparing it to going to other Disney properties across the world, then I can get on board with the comparisons.

That's why I compare like for like vacations.

However, I think from what I've seen people compare Disney in respects to costs. If they see Disney slipping on the value spectrum it becomes easier to compare to other places in their minds. Picking from a place that was mentioned Hawaii for instance. If you got the same feeling of value spent in Hawaii one may think it's fair to compare that with your expense to Disney and find that Disney was just too costly for what you got. That just seems to be a common theme when I see people comparing to all sorts of other destinations..it's usually framed in that Disney isn't giving them the same value it used to.

 

[Farro]

Wow, this is getting deep...

I mean, some of us are just complaining because the resort prices or ticket prices are too high. It's not really deeper than that. And this would be the place to discuss it.

It's a vacation destination. It's not actively affecting my everyday life.

 

[Mackenzie Click-Mickelson]

Wow, this is getting deep...

I mean, some of us are just complaining because the resort prices or ticket prices are too high. It's not really deeper than that.

It's a vacation destination. It's not actively affecting my everyday life.

But for others it really is..maybe check out the Podcast from Tuesday as it discusses that

**I say this as a person who isn't deeply ingrained in Disney feels but understand and personally know people who are. The Boards skews the emotional attachment route for sure.

 

[hertamaniac]

do I miss Disney? Of course, but my wallet sure doesn’t.

honestly, sometimes it’s nice to know that I’m not the only one that feels this way

I do miss the way we would enjoy a visit to any of their parks, on a whim. And when I first moved to central Florida (>15 years ago), it became a staple of our weekly/monthly visits. But along the way over the past several years, the degradation of the in-park experience became astonishing. For a non-local, I am quite sure it can be a wonderful experience and is thoroughly enjoyable. For us, it took years for, what I'll call "The Disney Factor" to chip away at our passion. To most locals I know, it isn't a matter of if "The Disney Factor" exposes itself, but when. I have big shoulders (emotionally), so I thought I could absorb paying more for an equal experience. But paying more for a lesser experience is not what I am willing to do.

So....you're not alone.

 

[ChipnDale79]

That's why I compare like for like vacations.

However, I think from what I've seen people compare Disney in respects to costs. If they see Disney slipping on the value spectrum it becomes easier to compare to other places in their minds. Picking from a place that was mentioned Hawaii for instance. If you got the same feeling of value spent in Hawaii one may think it's fair to compare that with your expense to Disney and find that Disney was just too costly for what you got. That just seems to be a common theme when I see people comparing to all sorts of other destinations..it's usually framed in that Disney isn't giving them the same value it used to.

This is it for us, for what you got at Disney, it was worth it compared to other vacations, because of the absorbent rise in prices, it just doesn’t hold the same value anymore.

there are other places to see, Disney had us, but they’ve allowed us to shop around.

 

[SarahEleanor]

I have an emotional attachment to WDW. I grew up going yearly. My father and I would count Disney Dollars before the trip. We made the dining reservations together. I loved every minute. I did the College Program and sold egg rolls in Adventureland.

My kids, on the other hand, sadly do not. They would much rather stay in an Express Pass hotel at Universal and stay in the Wizarding World for hours. So I take them there.

As silly as it is, my heart aches because I want the them to love WDW as I did.

I compared the costs of WDW vs Universal at Club Level for the same amount of time. WDW is twice the cost.

It all makes me very sad.

Where is the comparison for the value resorts at Uni being Endless Summer - Surfside and Dockside? I visited them and they really bring the down the median price and are brand newish.

Cabana is spectacular. I was just there a few months ago for another visit (didn't stay) and really like the pool area/vibe. It wasn't overcrowded and the relaxation factor is through the roof.

 

[grossmansr]

The emotional attachment is a free will thing though; we don't blindly follow our emotions, we have free will in order to have self control... But, I do understand trying to find others feeling the same way to share the sadness of that.

The Disney "product" has always been about an emotional experience. That's the "magic", right? Plenty of other financial decisions have an emotional side to them as well. Everything from choosing where to live, what to where, what to drive, and what to eat is a balance between cost and value. But the value of a Porshe lies in more than just the sum of it's parts. The value is in the emotional response we might have from driving or being seen driving it. Same is true about a Disney vacation.

It's hard to quantify or calculate the value of certain emotions. And therin lies the debate and the seemingly endless conversations about the value of a Disney vacation or certain Disney experiences on these boards. People feel all types of ways about it and it's helpful and reassuring to talk through some of this with like-minded people, and even people who share different perspectives.

 

[grossmansr]

Wow, this is getting deep...

I mean, some of us are just complaining because the resort prices or ticket prices are too high. It's not really deeper than that. And this would be the place to discuss it.

It's a vacation destination. It's not actively affecting my everyday life.

Right? It's funny when you think about it. Or, not funny, maybe.

 

[DGsAtBLT]

This. Right here.

I still feel the nostalgia. But will my children? Disney was special because even through they are in business to make a profit, they always seemed to make a guest feel like a Guest. You might have spent plenty of money but you did it willingly and it didn't leave a bitter taste at the end of the day. Disney had a way of making each customer feel special. Valuable. Important. Even if it was just a show, it was a convincing one. It's like going to a strip club. Do the strippers really want you? The good ones make you feel like they do. Disney was like a high dollar prostitute in a sea of common whores. And she convinced us all that she really loved us.

LOL this is the best description of "the Disney difference" I have ever heard. Thank you.

 

[Mikey15]

The fact that we have to preface that by saying "in the world of Disney"..kinda tells all lol.

Oh for sure. I stay off site and have recently tried tacking on a couple Disney nights on the front end of a trip, so I’m acutely aware of how crazy the pricing is next to the Orlando market. But it’s not just one resort, it’s the whole property. Meanwhile, ~90% occupancy...

I find people will rationalize a lot of expensive things on this board, and it’s amusing to see where people’s lines do get drawn.

 

[dlavender]

From the 2020 First Quarter report, found on line at: https://thewaltdisneycompany.com/app/uploads/2019/11/q4-fy19-earnings.pdf (page 4)
"Higher costs were due to new guest offerings, driven by Star Wars: Galaxy’s Edge, and the impact of wage increases for union employees."
Increasing labor costs were enough to show up on the quarterly report. While price increases certainly predate the new contract agreement, don't be fooled that Disney will not use that knowledge of new contract terms as justification to raise prices. And many will spend the extra bucks thinking they will keep some homeless waif out of sleeping in the car. And feel good about it. The new contract terms is the gift that keeps on giving too, as new minimum wage levels for the next several years means Parks and Entertainment can keep right on raising prices.

Don't believe everything you read on a company's financial narrative.

It's easier to blame union employees than it is to blame the current financial culture of quarterly earnings and shareholder wealth expansion.....

Plus, you would have to do a real comparison YOY on union labor costs with price increase % to see if there is a real correlation....

 

[Darcy03231]

We used to be yearly visitors (sometimes 2x and once 3x). Now, we tend to only go every few years and as an add-on to another trip. Last time I went was when we added a couple of days onto the end of a cruise.

My trip this year is the first one in about six years that will be a solely WDW trip. I was invited to go by my neighbor who is taking her 6 y.o. (who's like a grandchild to me). We're really close and she knows I love Disney, so it was very sweet of her to invite me. If it weren't for that, I probably wouldn't be going.

For me, I'm not finding the value in a Disney vacation anymore.