DAS changes coming WDW May 20/ DL June 18, 2024

[Becky Mouse]

Yes I’m guessing most reports today were from APs because they can go anytime, whereas people going on a once in a great while trip but not be 30 days out yet. It will be interesting to follow along and see what people report.
I saw one post of an AP saying she could be approved but only when she brings her 2yr old, and not when she goes with friends as her friend can wait in line and she can join later. I mean I kind of get it, sucks to have to be separated from your traveling party but it is an accommodation….

I think that makes a lot of sense. If you're traveling alone or with only a child/children, then some accommodations like the line return option won't work or will need to work differently. So, it makes sense that someone might be granted DAS for when they are traveling alone (or only with children) versus when they are traveling with other adults and can more easily do a return-to-queue or rider-swap type option. I'm glad Disney might be recognizing this and providing different accommodations based on the specific situation.

 

[jo-jo]

Someone a few pages back posted how they were warming up their vocal cords to say “Siri, set a 10 min timer” inferring they would be maximizing their DAS to the fullest extent possible. While you may be an example of a DAS user who rode very few attractions, I think a significant portion of DAS users over the past two years were taking full advantage of the possibilities presented by the access granted.

I read something on FB a few weeks ago, how DAS was great, we did 14 rides. Maybe there should be a limit , we'll give you this pass, but it can only be used a max of X times a day. I think most people would be fine with 6-8 rides.

Last trip, we had a great day at MK, used DAS four times on rides, saw a few shows and a spin on webway. Left the park happy.

 

[only hope]

But it DID work for many people in practice, that being said, it doesn't have to be an all or nothing approach, there can be a mix of free and paid options that would reduce the abuse.

It didn’t work as a whole. Even the current paid version is a problem. Anytime there is a skip the line option it massively disrupts standby lines. Those people who benefited from FP+/FP+ did so at the detriment of others who didn’t know how to use the system efficiently and would get only a few fp a day. I say this as a person who was very effective at using it and rarely used standby lines. I never joined a queue more than 25mn long and would ride nearly everything in the park.

 

[TwoMisfits]

Just giving my experience today. I’ve read a lot on this board, FB, and Reddit.
I am an out of state AP who goes about once a month. My current DAS expires May 23rd and I return May 23rd. I did the video chat today as I will be returning May 23rd and wanted to make sure all was set prior to leaving. I typically travel solo. Occasionally, I friends meet up with me.

I was approved for 120 days- again, I have an AP. I am not on the autism spectrum. I explained why I could not wait in the typical queue. I was told this approval was for me only. If anyone joins me, we would need to utilize the rider swap or return to queue option. I don’t know if this is another “level” of accommodations with a sort of partial approval. I really don’t know what this will look like when a friend joins me. I suppose that’s going to be a “we’ll see how this works” moment.

I go later this week and am not planning on having any friends join me. However, while I’m there, I am going to try to get clarification.

So, I was right - DAS of 1 seems like it's gonna be used a lot.

 

[Lugan]

We are getting into the weeds here — but you are overlooking a detail (and how good Disney’s litigators are) — they are NOT asking you to waive all rights to sue, they are saying you agree to pursue them on an INDIVIDUAL basis (both an independent contractual agreement AND agreeing that it’s “an individualized discussion regarding my personal circumstances”— which would weigh against a class cert decision. Essentially you can still challenge, but it won’t be a rich target for plaintiffs’ lawyers AND a defeat in one plaintiff’s case won’t require them to change accommodations for anyone else.

I'm curious about the legality of forcing you to agree to T&Cs post sale of their non refundable tickets / APs to be able to request an accommodation? Presumably, after the sale has happened, the customer is in an unfair position to choose whether or not to agree to these T&Cs.

 

[ForWhomTheMouseTolls]

Yes, it probably is money based, but maybe not in the way you suspect. If I were to guess and have a bit of a pessimistic outlook:

My guess would be that Disney knows that, per day, people with APs spend a whole lot less than families who travel once a year or less. When they had the free FastPass+ system, Disney probably had the data to know that people with APs knew how to use it best and maximize it to its full potential, and so people with APs were there more often and got to do more things while they were there--all while paying significantly less per day. Whereas people who rarely went to Disney and were dropping $10,000 on a 5 day vacation might not even know how to use FastPass+, might have thought they had to pay for it, or didn't know that they can get more FastPasses using the app or kiosk.

They probably designed Genie+ with all this in mind. They probably figured APs would be less likely to buy it each time than guests who come every year or less, and so that would stop APs from having such an advantage in lines. Alternatively, some people with APs who are more "well to do" would buy Genie+ each time, and now they're spending more in the parks per day. So, Disney probably saw Genie+ as a win-win to improve the guest experience for people who pay more per day and also make Disney more money and get some APs to spend more money per day.

What happened instead was that DAS use skyrocketed, mostly by APs. We hear that 70-90% of the LLs are filled with people using DAS. And there are so, so many people with APs on here who have said they never got DAS until Genie+ started because they could handle the waits just fine with free FastPass+. Disney must have the data on this for people who have been AP holders for a long time. They must know that the Smith Family traveled to Disney World for 10 years and never needed DAS, but once there was a paid service for LLs, then they got DAS. To Disney, it suggests that many of users might not actually need DAS but are more convenienced by it, even if they have a medical condition (which, let's be honest, most of us have someone in our family diagnosed with something like diabetes or anxiety or IBS, so most of us qualify in the old DAS system). What's more, people who rarely travel to Disney and don't buy Genie+ are now writing in with lots of complaints about how slow the standby line is moving, and Disney knows this is because the LLs are too long, filled with people using DAS. So, they didn't fix the problem they had before. It's actually created new problems, too, because people who are buying Genie+ aren't getting as many LLs as they would if DAS wasn't being abused and overused. The experience of park guests is being negatively impacted by DAS accommodations, and that's pretty much all Disney has to prove in order to win a lawsuit. They need to crack down on DAS abuse and over-use, and that involves denying a lot of people DAS by narrowing the parameters. They are still handling accommodations, though, by offering other accommodations, such as paid scooter rentals, noise canceling headphones for purchase, line return options, and more. But they are no longer granting DAS to every medical condition.

So, yes, we're going to hear about lots of people being denied DAS in the next few weeks and months, and there are going to be a lot of upset people. There will also be lawsuits, but I expect Disney will win those.

I have AP and DVC, and have spent 200K on Disney vacations in the past four years. Next year, due to this change, we have zero plans on going. I know enough about how they segment customers to know that they will notice our family no longer attending or going on cruises.

 

[Princesca]

Yes, IEPs can be based on a statistical differential between cognitive ability and actual testing performance, but they can and often are also be based on medical issues diagnosed by "a doctor".

Yes, and with our son, there's such a backlog that his referral for early intervention at age 2, BY A DOCTOR, can't get him an autism eval until he's 4. So an IEP at his preschool is all we have, but the reason he even qualified for that preschool is preliminary assessment by a doctor, OT, and ST. You typically can't get an IEP without some kind of trained professional being involved at some point.

 

[tinkerbelllacey]

I did the vide chat this morning for my DD who has severe developmental and physical disabilities. The cm looked at our account then asked how she could help. After explaining everything, DAS was approved. We had no issues

 

[clairenutter]

I really hope as this new system settles down we start learning that more people with physical disabilities are being approved. I am travelling from the Uk. I am staying at a Disney resort chosen specifically for my needs (pop century as it has a skyliner meaning I can come and go from Epcot and DHS very easily.) I can only manage a couple of hours in a park at a time. Amongst a host of other symptoms the one that restricts me the most is crippling fatigue. I will be travelling on my own. I have friends who will be over at the same time as me so will have a mixture of times with others and solo. I booked my Disney package last year in May. I booked my non cancellation flights in November. I will be spending probably around $6k on this trip. DAS was the one thing that would make this trip possible for me. ( used it on my last visit and quite honestly it made the impossible possible) I don't have a developmental disability it's physical. I can't cancel my trip. I would lose thousands. I totally understood that I would have very short days at the parks which is the reason I am staying so long. I was really really looking forward to this trip......now I am just really concerned.

 

[Philsfan77]

Just to hit again on the very clear shift to it being very needs specific, a poster who i very much trust has 2 children with Downs Syndrome...she did 2 video chats yesterday (one for each child) due to their school schedules. One child was denied, while the second one was approved. While on the second call, when second child was approved, she re-asked about first child who was originally denied, and got the same response that the first decision was correct regarding the spectrum of needs for the first child and why they were denied.

 

[Ariel1014]

By the same token, if people who were using DAS previously and are now denied are able to still able to go using Genie+ and ILL (plus return to queue), then did they need the DAS to make a Disney trip possible or did it just make the trip easier?

I am a solo traveler now and have used DAS and Genie +. I am fine with paying for Genie +, but I would need an open time to return because I might not be able to come back during the return window. Last trip this happened with 4 of my Genie+ rides. I had to tend to medical issues and was not able to return before the time ran out. And because Genie+ is one ride only, I could not rebook the ride I missed. GRs were of no assistance when I went in to explain what happened with those 4 selections. It was suggested I could come back to MK another day and purchase Genie+ for that day to try to get on those rides. I do have another trip coming up and called to see if I could qualify for DAS again but was denied. It was suggested to get Genie+ (even though I shared my experience of having a medical need and missing the return time). Again, I have no issues purchasing Genie+, but if my medical need needs assistance and it happens beyond my return window, I'd ask for 15 or 20 allowance beyond the end time. But that isnt an option.

 

[Princesca]

I just hope that they continue to continue the needs of the DAS holder but also the needs of the family. My wife is the one who usually applies for DAS but a 'leave the line' exception isn't going to work for her with our young child who is also on the spectrum. Unfortunately, we are in a position at Disney where neither of us can adequately manage him by ourselves, even though I do not have a disability that prevents me from waiting in line. I just can't physically wrangle our son while she goes off to a 'leave the line' solution and if she is in the beginnings of a panic attack, she shouldn't have to take him with her. (And also it's not safe as she needs to be able to focus on her own wellbeing.) It's not just about one DAS holder, it's about how all disabilities in a family unit intersect and, sometimes, what the NON-disabled person needs to be able to manage a family with multiple disabilities.

 

[clairenutter]

I am a solo traveler now and have used DAS and Genie +. I am fine with paying for Genie +, but I would need an open time to return because I might not be able to come back during the return window. Last trip this happened with 4 of my Genie+ rides. I had to tend to medical issues and was not able to return before the time ran out. And because Genie+ is one ride only, I could not rebook the ride I missed. GRs were of no assistance when I went in to explain what happened with those 4 selections. It was suggested I could come back to MK another day and purchase Genie+ for that day to try to get on those rides. I do have another trip coming up and called to see if I could qualify for DAS again but was denied. It was suggested to get Genie+ (even though I shared my experience of having a medical need and missing the return time). Again, I have no issues purchasing Genie+, but if my medical need needs assistance and it happens beyond my return window, I'd ask for 15 or 20 allowance beyond the end time. But that isnt an option.

I am so sorry thats awful. I completely understand where you are coming from. I would buy Genie plus if I thought that would make my trip more manageable. I don't have a an issue with that either. The issue I have is if I get it very fatigues and need a proper rest I could easily miss the return time. This is exactly why DAS worked for me on my last trip. Even with it I would maybe do 3 attractions max and return to the resort for a rest. I live in the UK. It's not like I can just come back for another trip that easily. The flight on its own is a mammoth task for me.

 

[jennab]

I just hope that they continue to continue the needs of the DAS holder but also the needs of the family. My wife is the one who usually applies for DAS but a 'leave the line' exception isn't going to work for her with our young child who is also on the spectrum. Unfortunately, we are in a position at Disney where neither of us can adequately manage him by ourselves, even though I do not have a disability that prevents me from waiting in line. I just can't physically wrangle our son while she goes off to a 'leave the line' solution and if she is in the beginnings of a panic attack, she shouldn't have to take him with her. (And also it's not safe as she needs to be able to focus on her own wellbeing.) It's not just about one DAS holder, it's about how all disabilities in a family unit intersect and, sometimes, what the NON-disabled person needs to be able to manage a family with multiple disabilities.

I found this concerning for some as well. What if the DAS holder has PTSD or panic attacks in which a member of their party helps with? Sending that person off alone in a theme park full of strangers is probably going to make things worse for many people…. In other words, some people can only handle crowds and those situations with the help of another person. So the accommodation doesn’t really help them.

 

[lanejudy]

I just hope that they continue to continue the needs of the DAS holder but also the needs of the family. My wife is the one who usually applies for DAS but a 'leave the line' exception isn't going to work for her with our young child who is also on the spectrum. Unfortunately, we are in a position at Disney where neither of us can adequately manage him by ourselves, even though I do not have a disability that prevents me from waiting in line. I just can't physically wrangle our son while she goes off to a 'leave the line' solution and if she is in the beginnings of a panic attack, she shouldn't have to take him with her. (And also it's not safe as she needs to be able to focus on her own wellbeing.) It's not just about one DAS holder, it's about how all disabilities in a family unit intersect and, sometimes, what the NON-disabled person needs to be able to manage a family with multiple disabilities.

By the ADA, accommodations are for the individual, not for the family. So while the need for a care-giver may be considered, the "family's needs" are not the high priority. If your child qualifies for DAS, why don't you register the child? Based on reports yesterday it is highly likely your wife will be told to use the Queue Re-entry, which would leave you in the queue with the child. Maybe a stroller-as-wheelchair would also help you manage the child alone.

 

[Princesca]

I found this concerning for some as well. What if the DAS holder has PTSD or panic attacks in which a member of their party helps with? Sending that person off alone in a theme park full of strangers is probably going to make things worse for many people…. In other words, some people can only handle crowds and those situations with the help of another person. So the accommodation doesn’t really help them.

This is so true. And also true in our case. I am my wife's 'safe person'. And our son has a history of running off, which has gotten better as he's gotten older but still happens sometimes and I'm not willing to test that at Disney. If we put a wrist leash on him, though, he resists it and tends to go noodley on the floor. Together, we can manage him, and my wife can control her panic attacks with effort, for the most part, for about 20 minutes, though it really depends on where we are in the day and what's gone on up to that point, her stress level in other areas, etc. DAS really worked well for us. And if one or both of them needed a longer recharge, we didn't have to worry about losing a G+ selection. :/

 

[Princesca]

By the ADA, accommodations are for the individual, not for the family. So while the need for a care-giver may be considered, the "family's needs" are not the high priority. If your child qualifies for DAS, why don't you register the child? Based on reports yesterday it is highly likely your wife will be told to use the Queue Re-entry, which would leave you in the queue with the child. Maybe a stroller-as-wheelchair would also help you manage the child alone.

We are - that's the plan for us with this. Previously we didn't have to register both of them. I'm hopeful that if my wife explains the situation we will be granted the 'old DAS' because the overlap of their neurodivergences is very difficult to manage.

And yes, I understand the accommodations are for the individual, but when the individual is a minor, the non-disabled parent's ability to keep the minor safe is directly impactful on the minor's needs - that's what I was trying (inadequately) to explain.

 

[DisneyMountainWoman]

I am a solo traveler now and have used DAS and Genie +. I am fine with paying for Genie +, but I would need an open time to return because I might not be able to come back during the return window. Last trip this happened with 4 of my Genie+ rides. I had to tend to medical issues and was not able to return before the time ran out. And because Genie+ is one ride only, I could not rebook the ride I missed. GRs were of no assistance when I went in to explain what happened with those 4 selections. It was suggested I could come back to MK another day and purchase Genie+ for that day to try to get on those rides. I do have another trip coming up and called to see if I could qualify for DAS again but was denied. It was suggested to get Genie+ (even though I shared my experience of having a medical need and missing the return time). Again, I have no issues purchasing Genie+, but if my medical need needs assistance and it happens beyond my return window, I'd ask for 15 or 20 allowance beyond the end time. But that isnt an option.

This is one of my worries... I am not sure if my son will qualify anymore after reading even people with developmental disabilities have been denied... we will buy Genie + if we cannot get DAS but the problem is if my son has meltdown it can be 2 hours long and now we missed our window... we really need the extended window time. Also he can hyperfocus on things and will sometime just want to ride one ride... which is not allowed on Genie +.

Luckily our first trip is not till Thanksgiving break so hopefully the kinks will have been worked out by the time we go. Our last trip... in Disneyland was just soo wonderful using DAS. We had so few big meltdowns using DAS. It was wonderful... it really made our vacation. DAS was one of the reasons why we bought into DVC. It is a vacation spot that had less meltdowns because of DAS.

Also a random worry I am having... now that Disney is pushing this leave the line and come back to your group we will have soo many more people "cutting" the line.... so many of my sons meltdowns at school have been over other kids cutting the line... my son is big into everything must be in order and in it's place and if anything is outplace it can trigger him... so with all these people going back in forth in line even if my son has DAS will be interesting for us. I will need to do a lot of prepping of what ever the system is to show this is just the system Disney is now using and they are not really cutting the line. Yeah good times.

 

[Princesca]

Also he can hyperfocus on things and will sometime just want to ride one ride... which is not allowed on Genie +.

So true - this is especially difficult for kids with autism and/or sensory processing disorder. It is completely within the realm of possibility that we could get to Disney and my son decides there's only 2-3 rides he can do. (And god help us if one of those is Peter Pan or Alien Swirling Saucers or something with an excessively long queue for the duration of the ride. Or Small World - RIP my sanity.)

 

[PrincessV]

Thought this was useful information posted on another forum. The poster claims to be a CM in Park Operations. I say claim, because it seems like anything that gets posted recently comes with a grain of salt when people don't agree with it, personally I believe that the person is a CM. Some of the below information is already well known such as the 10 minute "cool down" after using a DAS return time before you can get another DAS return time.

There is some explanation on how the queue re-entry will work and it reflects how I described it earlier with meeting at the merge point, but they also mention another version where some of the party immediately waits outside of the queue and then meets the rest of their party at the merge point, allowing everyone to at least ride together.

Also Rider Swap is mentioned as being an option and lastly they describe a "return to queue" option that works like the old DAS where you ask for a return time based on the current wait time in person at each individual ride, but this seems to be very limited and up to each CM at the ride on whether to issue one to you. But this potentially could be an option for people going solo that were not offered DAS or for the person who was traveling with their 5 year old grandchild - even though I know most of you seem to think this was made up.

“Because of this, property wide there is to be a removal of CM language involving "move all the way forward in line..." so there isn't any encouragement to crowd each other. Just to focus on moving forward.”

^ This would be a HUGE and welcome change that I’ll believe when I actually see it happen! The one reason I’m skeptical is that they really need to fill in all available space to avoid lines - think HM as an example - from inundating public space that shouldn’t have an attraction line in it. I visited during the social distancing phase of reopening after the COVID shutdown and that HM line extended back almost to the Tom Sawyer’s Island raft entrance.

I believe I read (in this thread) that if you need to change the party members in your DAS that you must go through the approval process all over again.

I asked about this when I called - that was 2 days before the rollout of changes, but I specifically asked my CM, “I’m usually visiting solo, but sometimes a local friend will be able to join me for a ride or two on short notice - do you know yet how would I go about adding them to my DAS party for that day under the new system?” And they said it would be an easy change: just go through the chat as if I were registering, but instead type in that I already have an active DAS and just need to change my DAS party. They said as long as that new party was already in my F&F list, it would be a quick, easy change that I could do day-of in the park, and that it might even be handled via chat without needing to ever get to the video call. They’re answer was clear and specific enough that it did not felt made-up: it seemed pretty clear to me that they had a process for that already.