Lack of FP+ options

[yulilin3]

Rumors have suggested an increase in virtual queues. I don't think it will be all rides but I definitely could see them using it more.

that's why I said not all. I could see an increase as well.
what most people don't understand though is that a VQ doesn't mean not standing in line, it just means less time standing in line.I think the VQ idea was already in place before the virus and obviously RotR was the big test for it.

 

[thanxfornoticin]

If capacity is limited, then it will not be a madhouse like you're painting.

I'm also a believer that there isn't going to be hoards of people rushing to WDW when it opens. Us Dis-ers are a unique breed of Disney fan, and I think it causes us to view things in a vacuum.

I do agree with what you're saying. But I wonder how much they can restrict capacity, and still make it worthwhile opening the parks?

We are unique!!!

 

[tlmadden73]

I don't see Disney requiring masks to enter the park -- I just don't think culturally we (as a country) would do that. Plus kids will rip them off .. adults will take them off to eat/drink .. they'll get dropped, lost, etc. Is Disney really going to kick people out of a park they desperately want back up and running if you aren't wearing your mask?

I also don't see them limiting capacity, but capacity WILL be limited for the first month or two of opening simply for people not wanting to or not be allowed to travel.

How that affects current FP availability? I don't know .. my guess is Disney is just lowering the FPs available in case they have to close the parks, or limit opening (maybe one of the parks not opening) ... or just having reduced capacity due to lack of employees.

 

[havoc315]

I don't see Disney requiring masks to enter the park -- I just don't think culturally we (as a country) would do that. Plus kids will rip them off .. adults will take them off to eat/drink .. they'll get dropped, lost, etc. Is Disney really going to kick people out of a park they desperately want back up and running if you aren't wearing your mask?

I also don't see them limiting capacity, but capacity WILL be limited for the first month or two of opening simply for people not wanting to or not be allowed to travel.

How that affects current FP availability? I don't know .. my guess is Disney is just lowering the FPs available in case they have to close the parks, or limit opening (maybe one of the parks not opening) ... or just having reduced capacity due to lack of employees.

Let’s assume procedures will be -similar- in Disney World and Disney Land.
They wouldn’t do temp checks and masks in one location, but not the other. For example.

Anyway, the Governor of California just states that stay-home orders will only be lifted with new physical-distancing regulations in place for business.

Quite simply, any physical-distancing regulations will require significant cuts in ride capacities.

 

[thanxfornoticin]

Let’s assume procedures will be -similar- in Disney World and Disney Land.
They wouldn’t do temp checks and masks in one location, but not the other. For example.

Anyway, the Governor of California just states that stay-home orders will only be lifted with new physical-distancing regulations in place for business.

Quite simply, any physical-distancing regulations will require significant cuts in ride capacities.

That doesn't mean WDW wouldn't open with FLA state laws in place, while DL opens with CAL state laws in place. Could definitely see that happening.

 

[tlmadden73]

Let’s assume procedures will be -similar- in Disney World and Disney Land.
They wouldn’t do temp checks and masks in one location, but not the other. For example.

Anyway, the Governor of California just states that stay-home orders will only be lifted with new physical-distancing regulations in place for business.

Quite simply, any physical-distancing regulations will require significant cuts in ride capacities.

I am sure there probably will be some business push back (lawsuits) on such heavy-handed government regulations on how a business can operate. Not that these companies don't care about people's safety, but government likes to make "one size fits all" rules that just don't work for certain businesses (like a theme park).

It comes down to people should make decisions on their own to protect themselves. If you are worried or at risk of getting COVID-19 .. don't go to a crowded theme park for a while. If you do, wear a mask, bring hand sanitizer. But if young, healthy people want to take that risk .. go for it.

Anyway .. off topic. I'll post here on Thursday morning my FP results for a trip June 16-20 (4 nights). The more data we have on that .. the more we can figure out what's going on.

 

[havoc315]

That doesn't mean WDW wouldn't open with FLA state laws in place, while DL opens with CAL state laws in place. Could definitely see that happening.

that invites negligence lawsuits.

Attorney: “My client contracted Covid 19 from your Disney World theme park, leading to weeks of immense pain and suffering before their death. Hundreds of cases of Covid 19 were traced to Disney World theme park in July 2020... yet not a single Covid death was traced to Disneyland...isn’t it true that Disneyland had safety precautions in place that you didn’t use at Disneyworld?”

Disney executives “... yes, that’s true..”

Attorney: “Disney employs heath and safety experts, correct?”

Disney “yes... of course..”

Attorney: “and those experts knew that the lack of those precautions would endanger more lives?”

Disney executive “well... the state of Florida didn’t require us to take the extra precautions...”

attorney, “just answer the question. You knew the lack of extra precautions would endanger lives??”

Disney, “yes.. we knew.”

attorney, “so to maximize your profits in Florida, you knowingly endangered lives instead of following the safer procedures you were using in California?!??”

Disney “well.... I wouldn’t put it that way....”

Attorney.... “I rest my case. Ladies and gentlemen of the jury... I ask you to award $100 million in punitive damages against Disney for their reckless endangerment of lives. They chose to pursue profits over safety. They chose only to follow the absolute minimum legal requirements, while they knew they were putting lives at risk. If only Disneyworld had followed the same procedures as Disneyland, hundreds of lives would have been saved.”

(I do this for a living... that’s almost exactly how it would go).

 

[GADisneyDad14]

All right folks, this thread is about FastPass availability and booking. All other topics can be taken to other corners of the DIS.

Thank you.

 

[gottalovepluto]

I don't see Disney requiring masks to enter the park -- I just don't think culturally we (as a country) would do that. Plus kids will rip them off .. adults will take them off to eat/drink .. they'll get dropped, lost, etc. Is Disney really going to kick people out of a park they desperately want back up and running if you aren't wearing your mask?

I also don't see them limiting capacity, but capacity WILL be limited for the first month or two of opening simply for people not wanting to or not be allowed to travel.

How that affects current FP availability? I don't know .. my guess is Disney is just lowering the FPs available in case they have to close the parks, or limit opening (maybe one of the parks not opening) ... or just having reduced capacity due to lack of employees.

I've settled into the camp that says Disney has lowered FP availability simply because they are projecting much lower attendance in order to preserve their line:FP ratios. They can gauge a bit on expected attendance based off of their hotel occupancy and probably their partner hotels occupancy levels for June. Accounting for locals is trickier but can be adjusted on the fly day of as far as FPs go. Disney can always release more- but they can't really release less.

 

[mommy2allyandaveri]

I don't understand the purpose of holding fp's back. Schedule as normal and if operations change, then make changes to the system at that time. It may mean dropping a ton of fp's but at least let people book normally.

 

[havoc315]

I've settled into the camp that says Disney has lowered FP availability simply because they are projecting much lower attendance in order to preserve their line:FP ratios. They can gauge a bit on expected attendance based off of their hotel occupancy and probably their partner hotels occupancy levels for June. Accounting for locals is trickier but can be adjusted on the fly day of as far as FPs go. Disney can always release more- but they can't really release less.

They have never reduced FP availability due to low crowds before. No reason to start now.

 

[AmishGuy91]

They have never reduced FP availability due to low crowds before. No reason to start now.

A lot of things have never been done before in the past month....

 

[OKWFan88]

I have a reservation for 6/13 thru 6/27. The FP selection for the first 7 days was paltry. But for the 2nd week, we were able to get everything. Only two of us going, but got FOP on several days, all the tier 1's for HS etc. Appears if you are staying longer you have a better opportunity to get FP on the latter part of your stay and the majority of the FP were for morning.

 

[havoc315]

I have a reservation for 6/13 thru 6/27. The FP selection for the first 7 days was paltry. But for the 2nd week, we were able to get everything. Only two of us going, but got FOP on several days, all the tier 1's for HS etc. Appears if you are staying longer you have a better opportunity to get FP on the latter part of your stay and the majority of the FP were for morning.

That's always the case. Because very few people can make 67+ day reservations...
Let's put it this way -- 100% of onsite guests can make 60 day reservations.
95% can make 61 day reservations -- since almost every on-site guest is doing at least 2-day tickets.
Probably 85% can do 62 days... Probably around 70% can do 64 days.... Probably 50% can do 66 days.... By the time you're talking about 70 days, as is your situation, probably less than 5-10% of onsite guests can ever book that far out.

 

[jimim]

Masks really would be worthless in the FL heat/sweat. Also they would have to keep the water parks shut down along with the few water rides.

If WDW wanted to be serious about any kind of real safety they should just limit the parks to resort guests only and do CoViD testing and anti-body testing before they check in.

ya masks in Florida summer. Worthless. I treat everyday with an n95 mask on and when I’m working and it’s warm I’m soaked behind that mask which makes it pretty much useless. I was just thinking about Florida yesterday when my face was dripping when I took it off.

they can’t stop locals from coming. No way that would happen. I also highly doubt they would do testing for every guest. That's pretty absurd. The hospital my wife works at barely has enough tests available.

 

[MomOTwins]

I don't think the reduced FP is about low crowds; I think it is about cutbacks on staffing. If you are only running one side of space mountain, you can only get half as many guests in and need to reduce the number of FPs accordingly.

 

[vinotinto]

There is a whole thread about the difficult fastpass availability.
To some degree, this could be an expression of pent up demand, but that can't really explain much of it.
We are now 60 days out from mid-June. A realistic scenario is Disney *might* be open but with precautions in place by then. Under normal operations, mid-June crowds should be a fraction of peak-level crowds. And even peak-level crowds have far more fastpass availability than we currently see.

The most obvious explanation -- Disney is anticipating running rides at greatly reduced capacity, and therefore offering far fewer fastpasses per ride. Reduced capacity may mean keeping empty seats between parties -- may also include more disinfecting between guests, slowing down the rides for a wipe down after each ride.

using the Dibb availability....
I'm posting this on April 14... I'm looking at June 15th, 62 days out. Touringplans projects this day as a 7. Under normal operations, a crowd-7, 62 days out, should have plenty of FP availability. FOP, Mine Coast, and the new DHS rides would normally be the only rides with real limits on availability. But we see some interesting things:
Magic Kingdom: Mine train has no availability, no surprise. But Big Thunder Mountain? It has NO availability until the 65 day mark, and that's limited evening availability. It has no morning availability until JULY 1 -- the 78 day mark!!! So either they aren't even planning on running Thunder Mountain in the mornings (in June), or they have reduced the capacity by so much that its booked so solid.
Further suggesting some rides wont even be operating in the morning: Monster's Inc Laugh Floor -- No morning availability. In June or July.
Epcot: Pretty standard, nothing "sold out." But Mission Space, Soarin, Test Track, and Frozen are all "afternoon only." Typically, you'd have morning availability plentiful at 62 days out. So again, a suggestion of more limited FP distribution than normal.
DHS: The height of absurd. 62 days out, there is no morning availability for any ride except Muppets. Saucers and TSM have very limited availability.
The earliest you can get any of the Tier 1 rides are 65 days -- No Runaway train, but evening availability for Slinky and Falcon.
The EARLIEST Tier 1 morning availability is 68 days!!!! How many guests are there that even have the capability to be booking 68 days in advance?!?!?! it must be very very limited FP distribution.

Animal Kingdom: Not shocking to see FOP sold out. But almost everything else is evening/afternoon only. No more more Safari available, no morning River Rapids or Expedition Everest or Na'vi. The only morning FPs are Dinosaur and Bug movie.
Want a morning safari FP? 64 days!
FOP -- 66 days for afternoon or 67 days if you want to ride in the morning!!


The point of this analysis..

Under our nose, Disney is indeed making plans for alternative operating procedures. They are clearly putting in place plans for the parks to operating at reduced capacity. All (or most) rides will be operating based on reduced capacity.

This creates a piece of the puzzle we haven't seen hints of yet:
With FPs disappearing 65+ days out... there will be extremely limited FP availability for offsite guests. If "attendance" is normal, and such limited ride capacity, you'll be looking at lines far far worse than Christmas.
But a crowded queue would defeat the whole purpose of coronavirus precautions. Plus make a miserable guest experience.

Seems inevitable that they will have to tightly restrict attendance.
Such restrictions will have to come in different possible formats:
1. Keep some resorts closed, cancelling those people trips, and thereby cancelling their attendance at the parks.
2. Keeping resorts open, but limiting attendance to on-site only, or on-site plus AP..
3. Like Christmas, have levels of closure, that are triggered at much lower attendance than Christmas. When 12,000 people enter MK, limit to on-site only. When there are 15,000 in MK, close MK entirely. (numbers are examples only).

Only with tight limits on attendance can they keep people moving through the amusement parks, when operating at reduced capacity and without clogging up the queues.

Thus, I see the limited FP availability as strong evidence that they are anticipating strict attendance limits.

Thank you for summarizing what you are seeing. As someone whose last 7 out of 8 trips have been 2-4 nights, during different times of the year comparable to June, I will say that the main headliners like FoP and SDD were available only on longer trips. But, I never had a problem grabbing a morning Soarin, or Safari, or Everest, or Kali, or BTMRR, or TSM, or Space. This is highly unusual.

 

[ryman471]

There is no doubt less fast passes available in June and no doubt it is NOT from the highest capacity on record for June scheduled, it is the opposite right now I am sure from this! Being in thick of things making COVID19 decisions for fortune 500 company that has facilities working through this as an essential employer, I would be completely shocked if they do get the green light to open in June, if they dont have at least a 40-60% max capacity allowed. shows will have spaced out seating (less capacity), cleanings between each person gets out of ride, markings everywhere where you can stand in standby lines and fast-pass lines, temp checks required. advanced tickets/resort package required and probably be sold out because of the low capacity allowed. I would be shocked if they would require masks. They can recommend but not require. All kinds of liability there if they require it.

 

[MoeJ]

So is it better to try to look for FP on the website or use the app?

I could not get FoP at 7AM at 60+4, no Tier 1 at all at DHS at 60+3, no 7DMT at 60+2, no TT at 60+1. Got some killer dining reservations, but that's pretty much from using ***********'s alert system.

And the taking people's temperature thing... Florida is HOT! I'm a Florida resident and native, and having an elevated temperature is de rigueur for a sweaty summer park day. Just not sure what that would actually accomplish. I highly doubt they're going to escort me into an air-conditioned area and let me cool down first, especially if people are doing park-to-park in the afternoon.

 

[MoeJ]

Sorry... didn't know mentioning the site I used for dining alerts was verboten here!