Wk of Dec 2--WISH Walking/Running Club

[chimera]

Hello everyone!

For those new to us, we are a group of people who are planning to participate in walking/running events throughout the year. For most of us, the ultimate goal is to train and compete in the annual WDW Half/Full marathons. We'll also be posting news and training for various other events throughout the year. We range from non-running beginners to triathletes. Come join us, whether you're training for an event or walking/running for fitness!

WISH Team

akasleepingbeauty Rhonda TX
aladdinsgirl Krista OH
AmyBeth68 Amy NJ
Andrea718 Andrea NY
andromedaslove Dana FL
bekagain Bekah
Big Vic Vic FL
Buckalew11 Brenda TN
budbeerlady
Calcio Craig MA
CarolA Carol GA
Cheryl N. WI Cheryl WI
chimera Mel FL
Chropistopy Christy GA
Cingoutload GA
Cruella de Mom Cecilia GA
crzy4mk Michael GA
crzy4pooh Lynnda FL
debm IL
Dennyha Denny OH
DianeL Diane
disneybelle Darcey NJ
disneyfanz04 Michelle NJ
DisneyGirl Marissa
disnygoof Christiana SC
disneyrun
DJBounce Darcey IA
donac Dona NJ
dthogue Tammy PA
escape Susie AR
fabumouse NJ
gatorphipps Christa NC
getnthinr Wendy NC
goingthedistance Paul NM
goofyguy1958 Mike
gradtchr Beth TX
hbardeleben Heather IL
hmgolden Helen NY
HMHunters
Hockeychic Kim CAN
hockeygirl Laura NY
Honeibee Judy NY
Houstonmouse Tracey
icunurse_celeste Celeste IL
Jen117 Jen WI
Jodi Jodi CT
jodistar Jodi CT
k_hase Kim NY
karebear1 Karen OR
Kareneast Karen NJ
Kaycee Kaycee KY
keenercam Cam DE
KeenHo Howard DE
KelNottAt Kelley MD
KeriZ Keri AB
Kim10110 Kim
Kimickey Kim MD
Kimwim8 Kim NJ
Kristi1357 Kristi NH
lillouisianagal Claire LA
Lisa Loves Pooh Lisa FL
littlegreydonkey Helen NZ
LittleMissMickey Ashley MN
lizdotcom99 Liz IN
macrosswife Kimber AL
magslite Maggie IL
maherae Anne
martysmom Jenny FL
maryliz maryliz ON
MdmMim
MelRhoads Melissa AR
MickeySP Lisa MA
Minnie Suzy
momoftwogirls K
monte Monica CO
Mouse Skywalker Dave NY
MouseDogMom Jackie NC
MrsTrx Tracey FL
msblrobs Sara NY
nstauffer Nikki MI
nucpharm29 Stephanie AR
NYCpa Kathy NY
ohMom OH
outonarun Teri CA
Papa Deuce PA
perfectmatch300 Nancy FL
plutosmyfav Sunny MA
pollioni Robb ON
princessmomma Colleen NC
Princess Nancy Nancy SC
Pungodingy Angie NH
Rachael Q Rachael BC
RedSonya Sonya UT
rKyDeX Chester FL
Rockclimber Dave NC
RunningLilo Dena FL
ryley26 Rich OH
sap1227 Christy FL
sara
ScoJo15 Scott GA
sjams Janet TX
skfulkers Steve OH
SoCalSnail Jim CA
solotraveler Kevin MI
Stenogoddess Lauren GA
stitch lover sith Erin
sugaswim Holly MD
TammyNC Tammy NC
taz4disney CJ IN
TEK224 Terri PA
thndrmatt Matt FL
TiffJ Tiffany AL
TigerLily03 Lily OH
TnTsParty FL
TXBelle Heather TX
Valentine Kathy NY
Viking Eric GE
Wbgirl Melissa MN
WDWfan 9 Pat IL
wfloyd Bill FL
WIsh I Lived in FL Felicia
wiskband Renee NY
wtpclc Carrie MI
xterratri Lynne ME

 

[chimera]

Musta been something in the air today. I had the most hideous, stonker, emotionally devastating run ever. 10 miles, most of the last 5 I walked. All mental stuff...just couldn't make myself do the intervals anymore after the first hour. Finished in 2:17.

Stephanie...congrats on your PR! What a great 5K time! Love the reindeer antlers!

AmyBeth... for your injury!

Christy...great to see you back! Is Cheryl not running with you this year?

Anne...hope you had a great trip to WDW...we're going next week to see the lights! I had some of those same arguments with my brain today.

Kevin...real men wear zebra

Lily...glad everything worked out with your new car! Are you planning to get the 'tiger' shorts

Jen...good luck on your presentation?

Tiff...good to see you back! Here's a little kickstart for motivation

Monica...I'm a full minute per mile slower on the TM than outside.

Jodi...we didn't get much out of PT for DD13. They gave her some stretching exercises and said our insurance wouldn't cover the 3x weekly that the orthopedist ordered.

Steve...hope the 20m went well.

Krista... for your ITBS.

Teri...congrats on your pace!

Dave...hope the Xmas lights went well. I try to think of bad LR as the dress rehearsal for the race. Christa can correct me, but isn't a bad dress rehearsal supposed to mean a great performance?

Cam...great pace...you'll be great in the full!

Looks like the overall consensus is to keep the list at least until after marathon weekend, then consider shuffling it around as needed for 2008. I think it looks split on changing the name, with more of a lean toward keeping things the way they are. I'd like to try to get the word 'marathon' in the title somewhere so we could be found in a search, but I don't want our threads to be unwieldy. Looks like most folks get here through word of mouth anyway.

I don't ask for help easily, but I'm hoping you guys won't mind offering some advice. This kinda means a lot to me. I've been disappointed with my pace for awhile now and I'm wondering if I've been holding back too much. With my awful run today, after the fifth mile, I decided to just play around with what was left. I usually do my R4/W1 at a slow jogging pace. I decided to open it up and run. I was able to comfortably do between 9:30 and 10 mpm...and this was AFTER 5 miles of jogging. I can't sustain it for very long, but I can do it...and at times, I saw 8:30 on the Garmin. I've been nursing an injury since last March that's finally improved...I switched to the TM for SR to decrease impact from concrete that I run on daily and I've been trying not to push the pace and save up for the end of the run. Do you guys think I've been working against myself all this time? I go straight into training for the Sarasota half right after WDW, so I'd really like to push the pace. What's the best way to approach this?

TIA!


Oh...and could I get a little football for the Gators? I can't believe USC lost...we could be in the national championship

 

[andromedaslove]

Oh...and could I get a little football for the Gators? I can't believe USC lost...we could be in the national championship

Nothing against you, you know I love ya!! I just can't afford any pixie dust for the Gators. It's the whole rivalry thing, ya know what I mean?!


Just a quick stop in to say Hi to everyone. Sorry I haven't been posting much. I have been so busy. I only got in two runs this week, some speed work and then my 10 miler yesterday. I felt really good during my run and finished at 1hr 40min exactly!! Next weekend I have my 24 miler, , I am really nervous about it. You would think, I have already done 20 and 22. 24 shouldn't make me that nervous but it definately does.

I promise to come back and chat with everyone a bit more later. For now, I am off to get the boys breakfast and the I am off to do more shopping for Christmas.

Dana

 

[Hockeychic]

Good Morning Team!!!

Glad there is a new thread I hope I can keep up with the one. I hope to get to know you all better so I can comment. I guess coming in this close to the race you already all know each other.

Can't remember if I posted yesterday but I did another 15 K on my stationary bike, beat my previous time by 4 mins 7 seconds. This is huge for me. Just a background on me, I have about 30 pds to lose before I seriously start training for next Jan.

Chimera, sorry I can't offer any advise I am just learning everything I need to know. But from what I have read here there is so much wonderful advise, glad to hear your injury is getting better

Going for a long walk today, since I am going to attempt the Minnie in May I need to start walking the distance before I add any jogging. I will post my time later this afternoon.

Off to have breakfast. Have a great morning all.

Kim

 

[Cruella de mom]

Good Morning Everyone -

Wow, I am beginning to think NOONE had a good run yesterday.

Matt- I did my 20 miler with nothing but powerade. I also got fatigued but but part of what you are doing on these long runs us teaching your body to run on little or no fuel. I find the middle miles are harder than the last few, I thnk its because you know how far you still have to go. You had great times so concentrate on that.

Mel- I imagine that after an injury it would be hard to push yourself. There is an emotional recovery as well as the physical recovery. Perhaps you need to experiement more often rather than sticking to a rigid routine. If the intervals aren't working for you, do what does work.

My "hip" is sore today. My coach told me not to crosstain today so I get an extra rest day this week. An extra day to get me mentally ready for my final 20 mile run on Saturday. After this saturday, my taper officially begins although they tell me I won't notice for a couple weeks.

Hang in there everyone, we can do this!!

Cecilia

 

[MickeySP]

Wow I have missed so much here.

WDW is so close and I feel so unready. Due to family stuff, my Mom had knee surgery and I have been playing nursemaid, I have only been able to get in about 5/6 miles a day, no long runs.
Do you guys think this will be enough to carry me through? I am gonna try to get a long possibly 15 in this week.

That is bad news , good news my pace is better and I can sustain a whole run for almost an hour without walking.

Anyone suggest a good R/W pace for the full? Need all the help I can get.

 

[TEK224]

Hey Cecilia - I had a GREAT r/w yesterday! My best time ever for 5 miles!
hoping to back it up today with a great 12 miler!. Haven't had too many great workouts lately, so this made me happy!

Terri

 

[Chropistopy]

Hi guys! Happy Sunday!

Mel: At the time of my last post, Cheryl was questioning if she would be able to make the trip. I'm happy to report that she's back on and excited for marathon weekend.


I had a decent LR yesterday. I only went 7 miles (scheduled for 11) but maintained right at a 12:30 minute mile. It definitely gave more confidence that I'll be able to run a good portion of the 1/2.

Here's hoping for a great training week for everyone!

Christy

 

[MelRhoads]

Mel - Good luck w/ whatever you decide. I think whatever you do has to be a personal thing. When I increase my pace significantly (i do LR's in the 11mpm range but if i want to i can keep it in the 9's for around 10 miles and in the 8's for 3miles) i get hurt. i noticed last year when i tried to push the pace, the injuries increased. I ended up deciding i want to complete and not compete (not that my pace was that competitive anyway) I think the real struggle is mental though. As endurance athletes, we are always trying to find our limits and then push them. We had that struggle w/ adventure racing this year. As a team we did really well on sprint races (8-12hrs), but then found some of our limits (for now) on the longer courses w/ really bad weather. We felt pretty discouraged about it, but also realised that we were doing it for fun and fitness. I would say, if you can still have fun and you don't notice increase in injury, go for it. Also, don't beat yourself up if you find you don't need to increase your pace. It just means you found an endurnace boundry (for now ) Oh, and, maybe you are an ADHD athlete at heart (like lynn and I ) and you need to find some other fun aerobic activities to mix it up a little. (break out that kayak!! They wild todd must be ready by now) Lynn and I (and probably cecilia) would gladly talk bikes w/ you in january!! OK, I've gotten so excited sitting here typing about endurance events, endurance boudries and bike shopping that i'm sweating (really!) and it's 19deg here this morning

 

[jodistar]

Jodi...we didn't get much out of PT for DD13. They gave her some stretching exercises and said our insurance wouldn't cover the 3x weekly that the orthopedist ordered.

Yeah - My insurance will pay for a certain amount of sessions per year but it just really seems like a waste.

I'm going to therapy twice a week and spend most of the time watching her help out the other people there. I'm thinking that working with my personal trainer is probably the way to go -- but I'm trying to make the best decision for me. I've asked my husband his opinion too and he agreed that I seem a little bit more upbeat after going to my personal trainer vs. physical therapist.

Decisions......hehe anyhow I'm going to threadmill it today, doing a fast paced walk. The muscle pull from last week is still a little sore.....don't want to do more damage - - I now have a book on stretching, so I will make sure I do a lot of stretching before and after.

 

[jodistar]

I was able to comforably do between 9:30 and 10 mpm...and this was AFTER 5 miles of jogging. I can't sustain it for very long, but I can do it...and at times, I saw 8:30 on the Garmin.

I'm the same way - - I can get the Garmin at times down to 7:59, but I think just do what you can and don't push it! My personal opinion of course.

 

[Hockeychic]

Wanted to get in my times before I jump in the hot tub to sooth my achy muscles.

Only did 10 K we are in the middle of a little snowstorm. Since this is our first time I don't have any times to compare it to but here it goes.

10K 93 mins 40 secs with a split at 45 mins 25 secs. Feel good but really hungry. Will be back on later.

Kim

 

[Calcio]

Mel

I thought a lot about your question during today's run, and here are my thoughts.

I actually think you are going far too fast in your jog surges, which is causing several problems.

First off, your pace in the jog parts approaches the pace that Christa (gatorphipps) runs when training. Since I am none of these, I'll point out that Christa is young, light, and really fast. 9 mpm is cranking along and I think it is too much to ask of your body.

As you increase pace you increase geometrically the pressure and stress on each footstrike. So going from 10:30 per mile to 9:30 per mile significantly increases the pounding your body takes, and the chance of injury rises as well.

By going so fast you also are likely getting yourself into oxygen debt and producing lots of lactic acid in your legs. This makes your body fatigued at the end of your jog sessions, so your body needs a longer recovery period in the walk sessions. A cycle of jog too fast and then having to walk a bit longer each time will definately slow you down.

I must admit I have been skeptical of members of our group who are averaging, say 12 mpm while training, but doing this by jogging 9 mpm for bursts and then walking at what must be a pretty easy pace to be sitting on 12 mpm. 9 mpm is FAST, the equivalent of a sub-2 half and a sub-4 full. Sustaining that pace the entire distance will place anyone very high at the Disney races, at least the fastest 15% of the field. Since running hard early is always paid back and then some in long races, in my opinion doing the jog parts so fast is self-defeating. Yes you are really moving in short bursts, but the necessary walk to recover slows you and in a half or marathon by the end you will suffer.

And deep in my soul, well not really that deep, is a competitor. When I am in the pattern of a person or group who is jogging fast and then walking to recover I point out to myself that soon enough they will drop from my sight, which always happens. They just cannot carry that fast jog.

I think to see overall pace improvement you should try to target a pace which you can sustain for longer periods of time. By slowing down just a bit in your jog sessions you should be able to stretch the time of these session, perhaps enough to surprise yourself. Just as speeding up past comfort pace requires payback later, slowing down just a bit from comfort pace should allow you to sustain the jog sessions for a much longer time. If you can do this you'll change your proportions of jog vs. walk, and I think see a nice improvement in overall pace.

At least in theory. Good luck in practice.

Craig

 

[keenercam]

All right, talking about aliens.
How could I resist the 5K for Special Olympics last night?
So, after doing 20 miles yesterday morning for myself, I walked the 5K last night for Sepcial Olympics. Overall pace, 14:10. But, at 2 miles, my time was 27:35, which I think is 13:47 or something like that.

23.1 miles yesterday.

And I am on my feet today with almost no aches or pains. Heading out for errands and xmas shopping and then work.

Glad to see everyone here and putting in the steps. Sending for all those with aches, injuries & pains.

 

[Big Vic]

Good afternoon everyone!

I'm typing this from our room at the POR. Got in last evening.

We're supposed to be out resort hopping, looking at Christmas decorations. But, the DW has come down with a bug. So, she's sleeping and I'm fixing to watch football. Kind of a bummer. I hope she's feeling better tommorrow, as we have tickets for MVMCP. Now I wish I would've brought my running gear.

Mel - Sorry to hear about your run. That's what happened to me last week.

To all of you getting your training in - Congrats.

Oh yeah, Mel, as a born and raised Ohioan, I will have to go with the Buckeyes to beat the Gators if they play for the Championship.

 

[rKyDeX]

Mel,

You may want to look into Heart Rate Training methods. I've been doing this for almost a month now and I like the method (probably because I get to track data and play with gadgets). It's a really good way to regulate "easy" and "hard" training runs. I'm using the book "Heart Monitor Training for the Compleat Idiot" by John Parker.

Basically, easy runs are governed by a "Recovery Ceiling" that equals 70% of your maximum heart rate. At times, this rate seems excrutiatingly slow and sometimes you have to resist getting "happy feet" and force yourself to slow down or even walk to stay below 70%.

Hard runs are governed by trying to stay above a "Threshold Floor" of 85%. The hard runs start with an easy mile or two, followed by x miles at 85% and then finishing the last mile at the easy pace.

My results are yet to be tested, by my 5 mile runs (1m easy, 3m hard, 1 m easy) are taking the same amount of time as my pre heart rate monitoring 5 mile runs where I would run full out for the whole distance.

I tried to use the heart rate method during the X-Country Marathon at Alafia River State Park November 19th, but was sabotaged by grinding knee pain just past the 18 mile mark. I ended up walking the remainder of the race and finished in 6h 13m. Not a PR.

The big advantage for me, is that going "easy" and going "hard" are determined for me objectively and not subjectively.

Chester

 

[MickeySP]

Cam - you are my hero!!

I am so impressed.

 

[gatorphipps]

1st of all! Craig - I LOVE YOU! Saying I am fast! And YOUNG! And Lite!

Mel - I have also thought about your question and was going to say that speed training would help you get faster...but at this point, I would not start it! I also agree with everything Craig said in his post (remember that I love him!) but for real...there is great wisdom in everything he says!

WOW the LRs were amazing this weekend...I know I have missed some so sorry!
Cam! You were flying and sounds like your recovery is going nice!
Dave - Is 20 miles supposed to feel good? Sounds like you did great! Don't worry about feeling like it was a stonker...The 1st time I trained for WDW (04) my 22 miler ended in tears. I told Ron (the guy who trained me and my beloved running partner Bree who went and got preg on me and now I have to run alone...oh sorry I was OT ) that I would not and could not do this...but I did and everything was fine!
Krista - lots of to you! I know you will do great on marathon day.
Matt - Glad your 16 went well!

OK! About my LR! I ran for 2:40 and not sure how far I went! I cannot pull up the google GPS map so I cannot track how far I went! Was supposed to do 15...and I know I did that, and then I added on.....DH and BIL were running 15 and I did not want to sit in the car for a long time so I know for a fact I went 3 extra miles...maybe further.....
I have to say...It poured down the rain and the wind was so bad that at times it almost pushed me off the sidewalk. When I finished, I looked like I had jumped in a pool...Oh also, my shoe was all red and I thought I had stepped in mud (we have red clay here in NC)...but NO! My toenail was rubbing against my toe and I was bleeding...my sock is still red even after bleaching it....YUCK!

 

[escape]

Good afternoon, everyone!

to all of those with stonker LRs this weekend. Hang in there! You guys are still my heroes!

for those nursing injuries, taking PT, and just downright don't feel good.

for Florida now that they beat my team - the Razorbacks.

Cam - good going! Whew!

Stephanie - congrats on your 5K. Where in AR was it held? The Russellville Reindeer run was cancelled this year. Bummer.

MelR - Have you participated in the Hotter than H*ll bike race in Texas? DH and I are going to sign up for it. He'll do the 100, I'll do the 50.

Kim - sounds like you are on the right track for '08. I'm fairly new to the group as well. There's new people buzzing in all the time - all are welcomed. Of course, the focus is on '07 marathon weekend now. Pretty soon, '08 will be the focus. I just hope I can make it through '07.


I did my 8-miler W/R yesterday - on the dreadmill. It wasn't too bad. Not sure about my exact times but I think I maintained <15 min. pace. Some people mentioned earlier that it is harder for them to run on the treadmill vs. outside. Whenever I use the treadmill at the gym, I find it much easier than outside. I'm able to run longer - instead of 2 min. at a time, I can run up to 3 min. at a time. Not sure why.

I've got a question for you all - how long should I soak in the cold water bath after a run? I tried this for the first time yesterday and I nearly froze my touchie off after sitting in the tub for about 20 min. However, I'm not sore today so maybe it worked.

 

[MelRhoads]

Susie - i have not done that race. I have only race my bike in adv races and tri's. I've done a 50 and a 100 but they were w/ the tour de cure (thankfully, it was nnot a race b/c i was slow!!) You'll have to let me know how that one is. i assume it is in the summer

did a lr of around 9 miles on the trail today. it was freezing and covered w/ snow. the resistance from the snow caused it to be pretty slow. i felt like it was meant to be since this is stonker week!!! I was miserable but i knew i had company!! The really weird part is that i ran that trail on tues. morning in SHORTS and today it was double tights, tank top, 2 long sleeve shirts (one from last yrs dis) and a fleece. Also, my nighmare b/4 christmas hat (to intimidate anyone else on the trail - not that there was anyone b/c the trail was actually closed and the roads to it were patchy (except one adventure racer friend on his bike and my friend w/ me (can i have an aside in an aside?)))Anyway....my sweaty hair froze under my hat. that was gross.