What is going on?

[k5xs]

I just returned from a week on business in Phoenix. I stayed at a nice hotel complex, and several things struck me:

1. Everything was open.
2. Everything was immaculate.
3. My room exceeded the best experience I've had at a deluxe resort at WDW, but at about one quarter the price. And my room was fully tended to by housekeeping every day.
4. Food/beverage prices were reasonable.
5. Staff was friendly and engaging.

So what's the deal with WDW? Why is it struggling so (apparently) to get back to "normal"? I get it, Phoenix isn't WDW, and I am sure the demand for hospitality workers is higher in Orlando than in Phoenix, but my guess is the pool of candidates in Phoenix is a lot smaller too.

I felt like I was in a place that had its act together, compared to WDW where it seems every week there is another sign that things are not getting better. I am glad to see things creeping back to normal, but between maintenance issues, menu limitations, limited housekeeping service, it's as though WDW--which in the past represented to me the BEST in hospitality--is now way behind.

Am I wrong? (Always a possibility...)

Are supply chain issues really that bad for WDW?

Is TWDC leadership disengaged? Is it too focused on short-term margins? Has it abandoned the Parks Division as a pillar of its business? Does it care?

And more to the point, where does this end up? I keep waiting to see a media release from Josh D'Amaro along the lines of "Please accept our apologies. We have let things slip too far, and WE HEAR YOU. We value you as guests, and for that reason we are going back to FP+, we are improving our food offerings, and we are doing all we can to let you know that we value you." But I'm not holding my breath...

The pandemic certainly caused perturbations, but was it really THIS devastating?

I think WDW has fundamentally lost its way.

 

[mom2rtk]

Is it too focused on short-term margins?

Yes.

 

[lowlight]

A lot of it falls on the management. I've stayed in $200 a night Residence Inn and it was immaculate with amazing staff, and stayed at $600+ a night Marriott locations where it looked like someone had never vacuumed the room and getting things from staff took hours and multiple phone calls. Some Disney resorts seem to be very well managed (Poly, Riviera are two recent examples I can think of), while some are clearly not. I think Disney's very top management are terrible, so they beget terrible middle management, and lower management, etc.

 

[jade1]

Does it care?

And more to the point, where does this end up? I keep waiting to see a media release from Josh D'Amaro along the lines of "Please accept our apologies. We have let things slip too far, and WE HEAR YOU.

Not sure anybody is at the helm from what I'm seeing.

 

[BrightMorningStar]

I think WDW has fundamentally lost its way.

100%

 

[SteveH]

A few thoughts... one is Disney his huge and a lot of people lost their jobs and the left... for good. They found other jobs that probably paid better and less stress. Disney has traditionally paid poorly, and IMHO it's come back to bite them in recruiting.

I've seen a huge range of their losses from $2.5 billion to $7 billion, I think Disneyland alone lost $4 billion. So IMHO part of what are you are seeing is not only the ongoing supply and staff challenges, but Disney is trying to make up for lost profits, on the backs of guests.

We bailed on our WDW 50th and went to Hawaii in October 2021 - like you we had full room service, great room, reassonalbe prices, plus oustanding interactings with the hotel and restaurant employees we came in contact. For Disney to still not doing daily room service (or offering it) at their over the top prices is flat out unacceptable and shows how the brand has been damaged.I honestly believe that this will come back to bite Mickey in the backside as others realize the value for their vacation dollar is no longer a good deal.

 

[The Foolish Mortal]

I just returned from a week on business in Phoenix. I stayed at a nice hotel complex, and several things struck me:

1. Everything was open.
2. Everything was immaculate.
3. My room exceeded the best experience I've had at a deluxe resort at WDW, but at about one quarter the price. And my room was fully tended to by housekeeping every day.
4. Food/beverage prices were reasonable.
5. Staff was friendly and engaging.

So what's the deal with WDW? Why is it struggling so (apparently) to get back to "normal"? I get it, Phoenix isn't WDW, and I am sure the demand for hospitality workers is higher in Orlando than in Phoenix, but my guess is the pool of candidates in Phoenix is a lot smaller too.

I felt like I was in a place that had its act together, compared to WDW where it seems every week there is another sign that things are not getting better. I am glad to see things creeping back to normal, but between maintenance issues, menu limitations, limited housekeeping service, it's as though WDW--which in the past represented to me the BEST in hospitality--is now way behind.

Am I wrong? (Always a possibility...)

Are supply chain issues really that bad for WDW?

Is TWDC leadership disengaged? Is it too focused on short-term margins? Has it abandoned the Parks Division as a pillar of its business? Does it care?

And more to the point, where does this end up? I keep waiting to see a media release from Josh D'Amaro along the lines of "Please accept our apologies. We have let things slip too far, and WE HEAR YOU. We value you as guests, and for that reason we are going back to FP+, we are improving our food offerings, and we are doing all we can to let you know that we value you." But I'm not holding my breath...

The pandemic certainly caused perturbations, but was it really THIS devastating?

I think WDW has fundamentally lost its way.

Where did you stay in Phoenix?

 

[Gabby01]

IDK, I enjoyed my WDW vacations this year and last year, although I don’t have recent experiences from before that to compare.

In my experience, though, when things seem comically bad at any organization, it’s because decisions are being made at a high level, which is out of touch with the situation on the ground and has its own priorities.

 

[redboat45]

It's Disney's choice to run this way. They're choosing to not bring everything back and run short staffed etc. Penny pinching to the max. Things could have been back to normal there a year ago. They just chose not to do that.

 

[reddog21]

I've seen a huge range of their losses from $2.5 billion to $7 billion, I think Disneyland alone lost $4 billion. So IMHO part of what are you are seeing is not only the ongoing supply and staff challenges, but Disney is trying to make up for lost profits, on the backs of guests.

This is not specific to Disney, have you seen the prices of the Universal hotels there double what I paid last year.

 

[yensid's offspring]

Much of the losses can be blamed on the pandemic and the supply chain issues but TWDC policies coming out of the pandemic kept them from rebounding as quickly as they could have. The remained in mask mandates long after Florida relaxed its mandates. Kept the masks for indoor spaces, cues and restaurants far longer than they needed. This was to appease a very small minority of people and kept many many others from going to the parks as they did not wish to wear masks even in indoor spaces. As a result of these profit losses they are slow to bring back staffing as they don't want to pay them until the profit margin increases. If they can run things with minimum staffing and still bring in the guests, give them slightly less of the expected experience but bring in profits, they will do that as long as they can.

 

[k5xs]

Where did you stay in Phoenix?

Gila River Resort, Wild Horse Pass.

 

[reddog21]

Much of the losses can be blamed on the pandemic and the supply chain issues but TWDC policies coming out of the pandemic kept them from rebounding as quickly as they could have. The remained in mask mandates long after Florida relaxed its mandates. Kept the masks for indoor spaces, cues and restaurants far longer than they needed. This was to appease a very small minority of people and kept many many others from going to the parks as they did not wish to wear masks even in indoor spaces. As a result of these profit losses they are slow to bring back staffing as they don't want to pay them until the profit margin increases. If they can run things with minimum staffing and still bring in the guests, give them slightly less of the expected experience but bring in profits, they will do that as long as they can.

Mask mandates really......wow! Disney has rebounded very well financially since reopening, the argument is did they rebound too quickly and destroy the overall guest experience.

 

[croschek05]

Much of the losses can be blamed on the pandemic and the supply chain issues but TWDC policies coming out of the pandemic kept them from rebounding as quickly as they could have. The remained in mask mandates long after Florida relaxed its mandates. Kept the masks for indoor spaces, cues and restaurants far longer than they needed. This was to appease a very small minority of people and kept many many others from going to the parks as they did not wish to wear masks even in indoor spaces. As a result of these profit losses they are slow to bring back staffing as they don't want to pay them until the profit margin increases. If they can run things with minimum staffing and still bring in the guests, give them slightly less of the expected experience but bring in profits, they will do that as long as they can.

Agree

 

[starlite_]

One of these days, we will be able to have a conversation where folks don't start ranting "masks! " in the first page. Today is not that day.

 

[Dcgc28]

This is not specific to Disney, have you seen the prices of the Universal hotels there double what I paid last year.

It’s not exclusive to theme parks. I do maintenance management for Topgolf and my maintenance team used to be 14 associates. I have the budget for 8 now. To say it’s an active choice Disney is making is incorrect in my opinion.

 

[AnnaKristoff2013]

Much of the losses can be blamed on the pandemic and the supply chain issues but TWDC policies coming out of the pandemic kept them from rebounding as quickly as they could have. The remained in mask mandates long after Florida relaxed its mandates. Kept the masks for indoor spaces, cues and restaurants far longer than they needed. This was to appease a very small minority of people and kept many many others from going to the parks as they did not wish to wear masks even in indoor spaces. As a result of these profit losses they are slow to bring back staffing as they don't want to pay them until the profit margin increases. If they can run things with minimum staffing and still bring in the guests, give them slightly less of the expected experience but bring in profits, they will do that as long as they can.

No. I mean, just not to basically all of this. Disney was maxing out it’s capacity long before it lifted the mask mandate. People didn’t stay away because of masks.

 

[maggymd]

This is not specific to Disney, have you seen the prices of the Universal hotels there double what I paid last year.

At least Universal hotels, I received daily housekeeping. Club lounge was well stocked with super friendly staff.

 

[hildarumpole]

No. I mean, just not to basically all of this. Disney was maxing out it’s capacity long before it lifted the mask mandate. People didn’t stay away because of masks.

Disney is still not at pre-pandemic full capacity levels. Chapek has stated this publicly. They may reach the current capacity level on certain days in some parks, but most days have reservations available in all parks. It seems just as busy, because not everything is fully operational yet due to staffing limitations and cost restrictions. We switched our Oct. 2021 Disney trip to Universal at the last minute. The deluxe resort cost less than CSR, plus we got Express Pass. There was daily housekeeping with the ability to text during the day with special requests. Nearly everything, except some play areas and shows were open. Our food costs were less than we've spent on our typical Disney trips and the food was good with lots of options. We're finally heading back to Disney next week after almost 2.5 yr. hiatus, and yes, masks were a factor, in addition to the other issues many have iterated on these boards. With an open mind, a positive attitude, different expectations, and lots of patience, we're looking forward to our return.

 

[Dcgc28]

Disney is still not at pre-pandemic full capacity levels. Chapek has stated this publicly. They may reach the current capacity level on certain days in some parks, but most days have reservations available in all parks. It seems just as busy, because not everything is fully operational yet due to staffing limitations and cost restrictions. We switched our Oct. 2021 Disney trip to Universal at the last minute. The deluxe resort cost less than CSR, plus we got Express Pass. There was daily housekeeping with the ability to text during the day with special requests. Nearly everything, except some play areas and shows were open. Our food costs were less than we've spent on our typical Disney trips and the food was good with lots of options. We're finally heading back to Disney next week after almost 2.5 yr. hiatus, and yes, masks were a factor, in addition to the other issues many have iterated on these boards. With an open mind, a positive attitude, different expectations, and lots of patience, we're looking forward to our return.

so basically in 4-5 weeks we’ll have to read about how much Disney sucks and how disappointed you are?