18% Gratutiy

[Paul in CT]

OK - so let's look at the numbers to see if the DDE card really is a good deal. I am using nice round numbers because my brain already hurts thinking about doing math. Your mileage may vary.............

With DDE Card
Cost of dinner (estimated) = $100
18% Gratuity before discount = $18
20% DDE Discount = $20
Final Cost = $100 - $20 + $18 = $98

Without DDE Card
Cost of dinner (estimated) = $100
18% Gratuity before discount = $18
Final Cost = $100 + $18 = $118

Savings with DDE card = $20
Cost of DDE Card = $65
# of $100 meals to 'break-even' point = 3.25
or $325 in meals

After $325 is when the discounts for DDE start to actually save you money over and above the purchase of the card.

If I put $65 in my PayPal money market account right now I would get less than 5% interest - so let's say for the sake of argument it is 5% interest.

Simple interest would pay $3.25 in one year on that $65 - compounding might bring it up to $4.00 - let's say $5.00 in interest in one year.

So if you plan on spending more than $330 in table service meals at Disney in one year then the DDE plan is worth it.

Granted, not everyone might spend that in a year. Being local and doing the restaurant reviews for the podcast I still think DDE is a good deal for us.

John

OOOPS - Forgot to add back in the $65 cost of the card itself. The 'break-even' point of the DDE card being worth it (especially after the 18% gratuity becomes mandatory for everyone) would be $395.

Excellent explanation! My DW and I love the DDE. We always spend more than $395 each time we visit with our AP's at least twice per year.

Although I do not like Disney telling us how much to tip (service charge), it will likely save us money since we always leave at least the amount of the 20% discount unless the service was terrible. We have yet to experience that over MANY trips, thankfully.

 

[Charlesaway]

We've all seen Disney roll out ideas and pull them back after a great deal of negative response. Who here thinks that this is one of those cases - they are testing public response to see if they can get that 18% back to the servers. Remember, DDP included the gratuity until recently - which meant servers might start getting stiffed. This is a great way to get it back, without costing the company a dime.

Or, is this just a precursor to putting the words "service charge" on the bill? You do that, and the guest has no recourse.

I imagine if it becomes a 'service charge' they will have to add it back into the dining plan though, as the disney dining plan is marketed in 08 as covering your dining charges, minus gratuity/tip. Of course, they would probably just add 18% to the cost of the plan again.

Also, I know things do change, but the last thing I saw in print, in the 2008 DDP flyer PDF, was:

Gratuities are not included unless otherwise indicated. An 18% gratuity will be added automatically for parties of 6 more more.

This matches what was said earlier in the thread, but theres more:

A gratuity may also be added automatically for ordered items that are not included in the Disney Dining Plan (e.g. alcoholic beverages)

So I'll wait until I see something new in print to even bother thinking about it anymore.

 

[danv3]

This would be a net loss for servers who wait on me. I tip 20+% as a matter of course, but whenever I get hit with a mandatory gratuity (an oxymron if there ever was one) I don't leave a penny more.

 

[Tine731]

I have to agree with the other posters. I want the option of deciding what I think is a fair tip for the service I receive. I am also turned off at the fact that buffet servers warrant the same tip amount as a menu restaurant server. It is not often that I would leave an 18% tip at a buffet.

Also, I was told by Disney (when making my PS) and also read it here on the dis that DDP guests wanted less food and the option to leave the tip...not an automatic 18%. The new tip developements have changed this. It will be interesting to see what happens.

 

[fakereadhed]

The 'break-even' point of the DDE card being worth it (especially after the 18% gratuity becomes mandatory for everyone) would be $395.

Thanks for doing the math.

I am also a nonconfrontational tipper and have never left nothing for a tip, and have left 15% very seldom. And I've had some bad service. But it is annoying to have to buy a card to save money on dining and be treated like a toddler about leaving a tip. And when I leave a separate tip, it just feels different than paying it with the bill. It feels more like it's going to the waitstaff, a mandatory tip feels more like an extra charge.

I agree that it is strange that they are coming out with 18% mandatory tip after they took it off DDP for the sake of the customer.

 

[madbrad76]

The way I see it, just because Disney is adding an 18% gratuity at all food and beverage locations they CAN'T force you to pay it. If you pay with cash, subtract the 18% from the total and figure out what you want to leave for a tip. If you pay with DDP, look at the total for the bill and figure the tip. If you pay with a credit card and want to adjust the tip amount, do the same as you would with cash and figure what you want to leave for a tip. Mark out their total for the bill and write the total you figured and sign the receipt. They can't charge you for more then what you signed for because that would be fraud. I think this is just their solution for those that are using the DDP since the 18% gratuity is no longer included. They probably feel that a lot of servers are going to get stiffed. By adding the 18% gratuity, more people will ashamed if they don't leave the full 18% since it is shown on the receipt. The only way Disney can force you to pay the 18% is if the make it a MANDATORY Service Charge.

 

[NYDisneyGal]

We've never bought the DDP when we travel to WDW, and this would help clinch that decision. With a family of 2 adults, 2 teens, and 1 kid (total 4 adults and 1 child on DDP) the cost of the DDP per day exceeds what we consume in food on an average day at Disney.

IMHO, the DDP has started to ruin the Disney fine dining experience. The last time we were in LeCellier, it felt like a dressed-up Ponderosa. (Now, don't start the anti-Ponderosa hate speech, I just don't like the place - where we live Ponderosa is filled with people eating way too much mediocre food simply because it's there and they have a coupon...).

At LeCellier during our last trip, the place was MOBBED with families, many of whom had children who were behaving as if they were at a fast food joint. Now, I know it's Disney, and I have a 6 year old, but when you are in a nice restaraunt you sit down and don't shout and shouldn't run across the restaraunt (character meals are excluded from this rule, kids get excited by characters and it's a hazard of that meal type that's to be expected). Even worse, the tables seemed to be piled high with plates of food that were half empty. We rarely if ever go out to dinner and have all 5 of us get an appetizer, entree, AND dessert. We usually split one appetizer, and often will splurge on two desserts to share. When I leave a restaraunt, I want to be thinking back on the experience, savoring how good what I ate was, not thinking about sitting down and resting because I'm so full I can't move. Families eating on DDP seem to think they HAVE to eat all that food because they paid for it and they aren't getting a good value if they don't. (I actually heard a parent scolding her child at the pool in Coronado Springs one day - the kid was complaining that he wanted to swim, he didn't want a Mickey Bar; she told him he had a snack credit left and he was going to use it! ACK!)

Service-wise, LeCellier was also very poor. We had a 6:10 ADR and weren't seated until almost 7pm, and then only after much complaining. Our server was distracted at best, and brought us what we needed only, never coming back to see if things were ok. Food from the kitchen came out very slowly. I would say that the food was "very good", but the experience was just not what we had come to expect from this restaraunt.

OK, so this has kinda turned into a rant on Disney Dining, and I didn't mean it to be that - I do love a great meal at a nice restaraunt with great service, and don't mind paying for it. I just don't think I need to do this every single night of my vacation! And, the changes to the restaraunts since the DDP was implemented, along with this new 18% "surcharge" on your meal are enough to nudge us off-site more. It's unfortunate.

(btw, I'm still keeping my ADRs at California Grill, the Brown Derby, and LeCellier for our upcoming trip. The Brown Derby and CG still feel elegant and we love them, and we're willing to give LeCellier another shot! Gotta head out to Celebration and try some zingers also, and hope to bump into the Podcast Team while we're out! - thanks for the tips, Kevin!)

 

[wilde_oscar]

I understand that there is a great deal of debate on this subject but according to Disney management, this is an "across the board" policy for all guests dining at a table service location.

I can not guarantee that Disney wont change this policy due to public outcr, but I am told that this is currently the new policy.

To sum up, this policy means I would no longer stay onsite (since DDP becomes worthless with the new policies)... and would not eat in the TS restaurants (marginal food with crappy service, I can get that anywhere). The service under DDP with the included tip was scetchy at best... but this would mean all TS would be subject to scetchy service. Wow talk about shooting yourself in the foot, twice, in one day, with a shot gun, while sitting naked, in the fireplace, while soaking a rash in rubbing alcohol.

I gotta agree with Kevin, if I were to eat TS I would expect service to be beyond reproach... anything less and I would be a squeeky wheel, and more then willing to walk away with out paying.

 

[calypso*a*go-go]

So let me get this straight...the only time Disney is concerned about the servers earning what they feel is a decent gratuity is when they aren't paying for it, right?

I'm sorry but this just chaps my hide!!! During our last visit we ate TS at least once everyday and during that timeframe (12 days) I would estimate approximately half the meals did not merit an 18% gratuity (long waits, empty drinks glasses, requests not met, etc). I guess the only good thing about this is that it might cut down on the number of people eating at TS restaurants and the servers will have more time at each table.

I think a lot of mangers are going to be very busy dealing with unhappy customers...hopefully they'll still have time to run their restaurants!

 

[JJ721]

OK, math time. Assuming a $100 bill and an 18% gratuity, and that the gratuity is added pre-discount:

Current DDE: $100 x 20% discount = $80. Add in the 18% gratuity (based on the $100 bill) and your total bill is $98.

New DDE: $100 plus the 18% gratuity = $118. Taking the 20% discount off this amount equals $94.40.

Assuming that you can ignore the fact that you are required to pay a minimum gratuity, this method actully results in additional savings. In fact, I would like to be allowed to add additional gratuity (as appropriate), with every 1% increase being discounted by 20%. Of course, the big downside in all of this is the fact that poor service will still earn 18% to the server (but only 14.4% to the DDE card holder!!).

 

[DisneyKevin]

OK, math time. Assuming a $100 bill and an 18% gratuity, and that the gratuity is added pre-discount:

Current DDE: $100 x 20% discount = $80. Add in the 18% gratuity (based on the $100 bill) and your total bill is $98.

New DDE: $100 plus the 18% gratuity = $118. Taking the 20% discount off this amount equals $94.40.

Assuming that you can ignore the fact that you are required to pay a minimum gratuity, this method actully results in additional savings. In fact, I would like to be allowed to add additional gratuity (as appropriate), with every 1% increase being discounted by 20%. Of course, the big downside in all of this is the fact that poor service will still earn 18% to the server (but only 14.4% to the DDE card holder!!).

I think your second figure of $94.40 is faulty. They will not take 20% off the 18% gratuity.

$100 check x 18% gratuity - 20% off original check = $98

Kevin

 

[wilde_oscar]

someone somewhere has to have gotten this story wrong... I am going to the garage to get my pitchforks and torches... let's go storming the castle.

 

[wvgoofyfan]

As a single diner, and a brand new DDE card holder, I really resent having the 18% added. Does this mean when I get breakfast at the POP, say for instance, they are going to add 18% to my bill. If so, then I have lost the 20% discount on my meal.

Or does this mean they are only going to add the 18% at TS meals.

I'm confused and I'm upset because I'm only going to get to use my card 3 trips before my annual pass expires.

Hoping someone out there can clarify this for me?

 

[pepperw23]

I have to agree with the other posters. I want the option of deciding what I think is a fair tip for the service I receive. I am also turned off at the fact that buffet servers warrent the same tip amount as a menu restaurant server. It is not often that I would leave an 18% tip at a buffet.

Also, I was told by Disney (when making my PS) and also read it here on the dis that DDP guests wanted less food and the option to leave the tip...not an automatic 18%. The new tip developements have changed this. It will be interesting to see what happens.

You bring up a good point. The thing I have been wondering since the word came out that "guests wanted less food and the option to leave the tip" is who are these guest? I mean I have seen a couple of people happy with the changes, or at least not complaining too much, but for the most part it seems the response is overwhelmingly negative.

 

[JJ721]

I think your second figure of $94.40 is faulty. They will not take 20% off the 18% gratuity.

$100 check x 18% gratuity - 20% off original check = $98

Kevin

OK, that was a question that I had previously. Thanks for clarification Kevin.

 

[calypso*a*go-go]

Or does this mean they are only going to add the 18% at TS meals.

Yes, supposedly this only affects TS locations (however, it would include buffets).

 

[1andrea]

Does anyone have the email address for Disney so I can send my views in about this. If we all send our views in they may review it.

 

[CanadianGuy]

Laughing Place is now reporting that they spoke to Disney and this is DDE only.

Honestly, could Disney have handled this ANY worse?

 

[pepperw23]

It kinda makes you wonder who is making these decisions.

 

[calypso*a*go-go]

Laughing Place is now reporting that they spoke to Disney and this is DDE only.

Honestly, could Disney have handled this ANY worse?

Well, it certainly doesn't help when we all enjoy playing "Chicken Little" so much (myself included!).

You never know, they may have been testing the waters with the first "news leak" to see how everyone would take the proposed changes...perhaps there are cases where they monitor discussion boards and react accordingly. I guess we'll never know for sure.