A family conundrum. What would you do? Perhaps a vent.

[cabanafrau]

I'd stick with what it sounds like you are doing, offering an ear to listen and be ready to help within limits.

 

[moniqueand2]

While getting to the vacation in Greece was with yours and your sons help and finances that's all water under the bridge. Maybe a lesson learned but...this issue of wanting to go home right after arriving is just a NO. I see that as an example of her wanting to control the situation and another example of her not understanding the importance of money and being wasteful. I hope your son enjoys Greece and stays on.

 

[Jangles]

I laughed through practically the entire post. Not sure if I should feel guilty or not.

THAT was like a comedy hour. And I assure you I am rarely flippant. And I am not without compassion for people's character flaws.

And I am all for letting adults be adults. And not getting involved & letting them learn on their own.

But for this one he was phoning for advice. So give him advice..I would say son - boy you have a lot on your plate & a some tough decisions to make. But if it was me, I would be enjoying my - insert your favourite swear word - wonderful vacation. I would be staying put whether she decides to go home.or not. And I certainly would be partaking in all the sites and glorious food surrounding you. Have a wonderful time.

That’s more or less what I said. Give her the option or staying and you pay or if she wants to return to London, don’t waste your holiday and stay and enjoy yourself. I had an inkling that something wasn’t right, because as a family we usually tease each other by sharing photographs of glasses of wine, beers , delicious food etc., when on holiday. All he has sent this trip is a photograph of a packet of potato chips… not even a Greek coffee.

 

[scrapquitler]

My son is 25. In November he started going out with a woman of a similar age and for his birthday in December she gifted him a 9 day holiday in Kos, (Greek Island) and some experiences …paragliding, wine tasting and a boat trip. To me it seemed too much too soon but I said nothing. Then it turned out that all she had actually purchased were two cheap budget airline flights, which cost her about £80 in total. Still generous but not exactly the gift as described to him. My son lives and works in London and about half his salary goes on rent, utilities, travel to work etc., and although I help him out occasionally (for example buying lunch or dinner when I visit London, or treating him to some clothes and slipping him the odd £50), he largely stands on his own two feet and has to be careful with what is left of his salary. His gf also rents in London and has just finished a Masters degree and relies on her parents and works in bars etc., to finance herself. When I discovered that the gf had not booked an hotel, I gave my son some credit card points I had which paid for their hotel for 7 days. I had enough for all 9 days but his gf wanted them to book an Airbnb for the other two nights when they got to Kos. I also gave him about Euros 200, left over from a trip I had recently taken to Europe. My son saved a bit every month for the trip, eventually putting £400 aside. Then last month he told me that his gf had borrowed £400 from him as she was behind on her rent and her parents wouldn’t help her out any more. When she was paid at the end of March, she paid him back. I asked him how she was going to be able to pay him back, pay her rent etc., and have spending money for the holiday, but he didn’t know (and it wasn’t any of my business). Anyway, they flew to Kos on Sunday night. Today (Wednesday) he telephoned for advice. His gf announced yesterday that she has no money at all to spend during the holiday, but was refusing to allow him to pay for meals out, trips etc and thought that they should fly home, even though that meant buying new return flights and wasting the prepaid hotel room. It turns out that she hasn’t booked any experiences, or has booked them but not paid for them. The hotel is nice, not grand, but nice enough, on the beach in Kos town, and the room has a sea view and balcony, with a table and chairs and a kitchenette and so far they have been catering for themselves, rather than eating out. My son has been buying groceries, but he wants to enjoy the holiday, visit some sites, go for drinks, eat at some local tavernas etc. I suggested that he should offer to finance the rest of the trip and that I would help him out. He said that he thinks he has enough money, so doesn’t need any money from me. The Airbnb they found for the last two nights is only Euros 60 and she is vegan and only eats raw foods, so hardly an expensive date. I also offered to lend him some money to lend to the gf but made it clear to my son that I would view it as his indebtedness to me not hers. When he made both offers to the gf she accused him of being selfish for wanting to continue with the holiday. What? She wants to fly home and organise a bank loan to pay her debts. She flat shares with a couple of other girls and apparently she has fallen behind with her rent , WiFi has been cut off and gas and electric are threatening to cut them off. I suggested to my son that if she wants to return to London he should stay and enjoy the rest of the holiday alone. He had a gap year backpacking in South America, and he is very sociable, so I am sure that he will still have fun. Does her behaviour strike you as odd? Isn’t she being the selfish one? He assures me that the relationship is in a good place. I do feel sorry for her because I am sure it is horrible worrying about debts, but why did she not tell my son of her situation before they left? Or am I missing something and looking at this the wrong way?

I have a young adult that age. My suggestion would be to STAY OUT OF IT. Let your son and his girlfriend just finish their trip as they can/wish. They can still have a good time cooking their own meals and doing whatever activities they can do for free without booking anything expensive.

 

[Colleen27]

Her behaviour strikes me as all kinds of odd. Red flags everywhere. My advice to my son - who is the same age and with whom I very rarely use the phrase "none of my business" about something he brings to me directly - would be to tell the girlfriend something along the lines of "We're here already and going home early is going to cost more than staying. Either let me pay some things and enjoy this beautiful place with me, or go home on your own because I'm not going to spend extra to not enjoy the things that are already paid for."

Then I'd give him a gentle reminder about what a bad idea it is to ever cosign for someone or "help" them by loaning them money they have no ability to repay.

But I know my son wouldn't spill all those details to me unless he wanted feedback/an outside perspective, so I wouldn't be worried about pushing him away or discouraging communication by not being more polite. And we're long past the days of him doing the opposite of what I suggest out of rebellion or misplaced notions of independence, so I know he values and considers the feedback I give him even if he decides he disagrees with it in the end.

 

[lisaviolet]

That’s more or less what I said. Give her the option or staying and you pay or if she wants to return to London, don’t waste your holiday and stay and enjoy yourself. I had an inkling that something wasn’t right, because as a family we usually tease each other by sharing photographs of glasses of wine, beers , delicious food etc., when on holiday. All he has sent this trip is a photograph of a packet of potato chips… not even a Greek coffee.

OMG, it is too much.

Not even a Greek coffee. Priceless..

This will be a hysterical memory one day for him, once he gets through it..

Hopefully he grabs the reins and has his vacation. But either way, blessings to you all.

 

[Miffy]

If I were you, OP, my main concern would be that your son is being set up to be fleeced by his (supposed) gf.

It reminds me a bit of a relationship I had in my early 20s. The guy started off being generous and ended up basically destroying me financially. It took me years to recover. I was young and naive and had never encountered someone like him. He was charming, attentive, loving, etc., but it was all a front. There are people who are really good at this kind of manipulation and your son's gf is exhibiting a lot of this sort of behavior.

If this were my son (I have no kids, so take that into consideration), I'd at least tell him to be very very careful and never help her out with money. Ever. She's showing him exactly who she is. The likelihood of this all being some very unusual set of circumstances is low. Even her parents have cut her off--and they know her better than your son does.

 

[Jangles]

I have a young adult that age. My suggestion would be to STAY OUT OF IT. Let your son and his girlfriend just finish their trip as they can/wish. They can still have a good time cooking their own meals and doing whatever activities they can do for free without booking anything expensive.

Except he telephoned me to ask for advice and talk it through, so I couldn’t really stay out of it. As I said I am a believer in letting my children make and learn from their mistakes. I suppose what I am asking on here is whether I am not seeing something from her side. I was very much brought up with the ‘never a borrower or a lender be’ rule.

 

[Praying Colonel]

I had to look up the meaning of TLDR. I very very rarely pour my heart out on here, but I came to chat with friends. With the greatest respect, if you can’t be bothered to read what I wrote, please scroll to another thread.

Respectfully, I'd like to read it, but it's literally difficult to do so. Hoping someone could make it easier, sorry. Good luck with your family issue.

 

[Jangles]

OMG, it is too much.

Not even a Greek coffee. Priceless..

This will be a hysterical memory one day for him, once he gets through it..

Hopefully he grabs the reins and has his vacation. But either way, blessings to you all.

Your reaction is so much like his older sister’s.

 

[Jangles]

Respectfully, I'd like to read it, but it's literally difficult to do so. Hoping someone could make it easier, sorry. Good luck with your family issue.

Sorry I was a bit snappy.

In a nutshell…. Basically my 25 year old son has gone on holiday with his gf and two days in she has announced she has not a penny to her name, is in debt and wants to come home to organise a bank loan.
He is willing to pay for everything on holiday or stay there alone while she flies home, and she has accused him of being selfish. Selfish, I suppose, for wanting to enjoy the holiday and not understand her feelings of worry about having no money.

 

[AppleDumpling]

Ordinarily I would say stay out of your adult child’s love life. But in this case, your son called to ask for advice, and frankly, I would have told him the same thing you did. If she chooses to leave, and their relationship ends because of it, she’ll be doing him a favor. Your son sounds like a responsible young man and can do better.

 

[FQLover]

@Praying Colonel This wasn't hard or time-consuming to do! Copy and paste. Hope you can read it now.

OP: Glad you felt like you could share this worry here. Lots of good and thoughtful people who can chime in with their reactions or experiences.

************************

My son is 25. In November he started going out with a woman of a similar age and for his birthday in December she gifted him a 9 day holiday in Kos, (Greek Island) and some experiences …paragliding, wine tasting and a boat trip. To me it seemed too much too soon but I said nothing. Then it turned out that all she had actually purchased were two cheap budget airline flights, which cost her about £80 in total. Still generous but not exactly the gift as described to him.

My son lives and works in London and about half his salary goes on rent, utilities, travel to work etc., and although I help him out occasionally (for example buying lunch or dinner when I visit London, or treating him to some clothes and slipping him the odd £50), he largely stands on his own two feet and has to be careful with what is left of his salary. His gf also rents in London and has just finished a Masters degree and relies on her parents and works in bars etc., to finance herself.

When I discovered that the gf had not booked an hotel, I gave my son some credit card points I had which paid for their hotel for 7 days. I had enough for all 9 days but his gf wanted them to book an Airbnb for the other two nights when they got to Kos. I also gave him about Euros 200, left over from a trip I had recently taken to Europe. My son saved a bit every month for the trip, eventually putting £400 aside. Then last month he told me that his gf had borrowed £400 from him as she was behind on her rent and her parents wouldn’t help her out any more.

When she was paid at the end of March, she paid him back. I asked him how she was going to be able to pay him back, pay her rent etc., and have spending money for the holiday, but he didn’t know (and it wasn’t any of my business). Anyway, they flew to Kos on Sunday night. Today (Wednesday) he telephoned for advice. His gf announced yesterday that she has no money at all to spend during the holiday, but was refusing to allow him to pay for meals out, trips etc and thought that they should fly home, even though that meant buying new return flights and wasting the prepaid hotel room.

It turns out that she hasn’t booked any experiences, or has booked them but not paid for them. The hotel is nice, not grand, but nice enough, on the beach in Kos town, and the room has a sea view and balcony, with a table and chairs and a kitchenette and so far they have been catering for themselves, rather than eating out. My son has been buying groceries, but he wants to enjoy the holiday, visit some sites, go for drinks, eat at some local tavernas etc. I suggested that he should offer to finance the rest of the trip and that I would help him out. He said that he thinks he has enough money, so doesn’t need any money from me. The Airbnb they found for the last two nights is only Euros 60 and she is vegan and only eats raw foods, so hardly an expensive date.

I also offered to lend him some money to lend to the gf but made it clear to my son that I would view it as his indebtedness to me not hers. When he made both offers to the gf she accused him of being selfish for wanting to continue with the holiday. What? She wants to fly home and organise a bank loan to pay her debts. She flat shares with a couple of other girls and apparently she has fallen behind with her rent , WiFi has been cut off and gas and electric are threatening to cut them off.

I suggested to my son that if she wants to return to London he should stay and enjoy the rest of the holiday alone. He had a gap year backpacking in South America, and he is very sociable, so I am sure that he will still have fun. Does her behaviour strike you as odd? Isn’t she being the selfish one?

He assures me that the relationship is in a good place. I do feel sorry for her because I am sure it is horrible worrying about debts, but why did she not tell my son of her situation before they left? Or am I missing something and looking at this the wrong way?

***************************

 

[persnickity]

If she's manipulating him, I'm not sure what her end game is - maybe she was hoping he would beg her to stay and offer to pay for everything, no strings attached? Or laying the groundwork for the fact that she is likely to be thrown out on her ear by her irritated roommates when they get back.

It's just as likely that she's just a young adult without much life experience who is in over her head financially and not dealing with it very well. She should probably go stay with her parents for a while to get her finances in order.

Either way, I don't think she has the right to decide what HE does here - he should enjoy the rest of his vacation, the most expensive parts are already taken care of.

 

[Colleen27]

Except he telephoned me to ask for advice and talk it through, so I couldn’t really stay out of it. As I said I am a believer in letting my children make and learn from their mistakes. I suppose what I am asking on here is whether I am not seeing something from her side. I was very much brought up with the ‘never a borrower or a lender be’ rule.

Oh, I certainly see some things that might be factoring in on her side. She just finished a masters. She may have overestimated her ability to find work with her degree, or overestimated what the work she could find would pay, and simply got in over her head with planning a holiday that she figured she'd have the funds for by the time it rolled around. She may also have anticipated her parents continuing to help her through the transition from school/part time work into a full time career, and figured her ability to fund the holiday based on their continuing help with rent and utilities and such. If that's the case, the failure to pull it all together is probably riding her hard right now, to the point of not being able to enjoy herself, hence the desire to go home and deal with the mess she's made Right. Now. rather than in a few days' time. She may also be getting a lot of pressure from her roommates to figure it out now, not when she gets back from a trip they no doubt realize she shouldn't have taken. Which is why I don't automatically leap to some of the more dire places other posters have gone. But none of that changes what I think the best course forward from the present moment is.

 

[Lumpy1106]

IMHO, you should not travel with a partner like this unless you intend for your relationship to be a long-term thing. And, if it is a long-term thing, you need to think of anything money-wise as a couple expense, not an individual one. There is no paying back; it's a couple, and income is rarely equal in any relationship.

SO...
Is your son willing to continue this relationship, debt and all? In that case, they should move in together, get married, and HE should start making all of THEIR financial decisions. She fails miserably at every turn and it's not going to get better as long as they are thinking in terms of his money and her money.

OR...
is he about done with her nonsense and is ready to end the relationship?

I think I speak for this group when I say it should be the latter, but then your first sentence said it all, he is 25. This is his decision to make. If he is willing to ignore all the red flags, well, he's about to learn one of those big life lessons. LET HIM!

 

[Miffy]

I was willing to give the gf some leeway and make a few excuses for her--she's young, this is all new, etc., etc., etc.--but read the OP's original post.

GF told OP's son that he was being selfish. Really? That is Manipulation 101.

 

[brockash]

My son is 25. In November he started going out with a woman of a similar age and for his birthday in December she gifted him a 9 day holiday in Kos, (Greek Island) and some experiences …paragliding, wine tasting and a boat trip. To me it seemed too much too soon but I said nothing. Then it turned out that all she had actually purchased were two cheap budget airline flights, which cost her about £80 in total. Still generous but not exactly the gift as described to him. My son lives and works in London and about half his salary goes on rent, utilities, travel to work etc., and although I help him out occasionally (for example buying lunch or dinner when I visit London, or treating him to some clothes and slipping him the odd £50), he largely stands on his own two feet and has to be careful with what is left of his salary. His gf also rents in London and has just finished a Masters degree and relies on her parents and works in bars etc., to finance herself. When I discovered that the gf had not booked an hotel, I gave my son some credit card points I had which paid for their hotel for 7 days. I had enough for all 9 days but his gf wanted them to book an Airbnb for the other two nights when they got to Kos. I also gave him about Euros 200, left over from a trip I had recently taken to Europe. My son saved a bit every month for the trip, eventually putting £400 aside. Then last month he told me that his gf had borrowed £400 from him as she was behind on her rent and her parents wouldn’t help her out any more. When she was paid at the end of March, she paid him back. I asked him how she was going to be able to pay him back, pay her rent etc., and have spending money for the holiday, but he didn’t know (and it wasn’t any of my business). Anyway, they flew to Kos on Sunday night. Today (Wednesday) he telephoned for advice. His gf announced yesterday that she has no money at all to spend during the holiday, but was refusing to allow him to pay for meals out, trips etc and thought that they should fly home, even though that meant buying new return flights and wasting the prepaid hotel room. It turns out that she hasn’t booked any experiences, or has booked them but not paid for them. The hotel is nice, not grand, but nice enough, on the beach in Kos town, and the room has a sea view and balcony, with a table and chairs and a kitchenette and so far they have been catering for themselves, rather than eating out. My son has been buying groceries, but he wants to enjoy the holiday, visit some sites, go for drinks, eat at some local tavernas etc. I suggested that he should offer to finance the rest of the trip and that I would help him out. He said that he thinks he has enough money, so doesn’t need any money from me. The Airbnb they found for the last two nights is only Euros 60 and she is vegan and only eats raw foods, so hardly an expensive date. I also offered to lend him some money to lend to the gf but made it clear to my son that I would view it as his indebtedness to me not hers. When he made both offers to the gf she accused him of being selfish for wanting to continue with the holiday. What? She wants to fly home and organise a bank loan to pay her debts. She flat shares with a couple of other girls and apparently she has fallen behind with her rent , WiFi has been cut off and gas and electric are threatening to cut them off. I suggested to my son that if she wants to return to London he should stay and enjoy the rest of the holiday alone. He had a gap year backpacking in South America, and he is very sociable, so I am sure that he will still have fun. Does her behaviour strike you as odd? Isn’t she being the selfish one? He assures me that the relationship is in a good place. I do feel sorry for her because I am sure it is horrible worrying about debts, but why did she not tell my son of her situation before they left? Or am I missing something and looking at this the wrong way?

Hopefully he ends up breaking up with her. She sounds like a huge headache.

 

[barkley]

Like she discovers she is pregnant .

or claims to be (someone unwilling to co-sign for a loan can be piggybacked onto as a responsible party for loan purposes via marriage in some places, it's not unheard of for someone to do this).

 

[hopemax]

I agree with everyone else that says he should stay and enjoy his holiday but consider the relationship at an end. This sounds like one of those stories that will be a good learning experience not only for OP's son now, but to tell his children in the future about the trials and tribulations of young love. If she wants to stay, and you/he fund the eats and sights in a frugal yet fun way that twentysomethings do, might as well make some lemonade from the lemons and rack up the life experience points. Otherwise, let her find her own way home.