Venting about school policy on Disney trip absences!!!

[FredS]

I took my oldest daughter out of school (missing 2-3 days each time) for WDW trips when she was in K-5, first grade and second grade. While the absences were unexcused, she was rarely absent otherwise, her teachers had no objection and it had no effect on her grades. We hoped to do the same in third grade, but that year the teacher indicated it would present a problem, in that she would miss instruction and according to school policy she was not supposed to go back through lessons with students which were missed due to unexcused absences. I think that is COMPLETELY REASONABLE!!!!! We rescheduled our trip to a time when school was not in session.

Teachers have hard enough jobs. It is unfair that, just because it is more convenient for us to go during school that we should make their lives harder. What if every student just decided to show up if and when they wanted and teachers were forced to repeat lessons at the whim of vacationing parents? Rules are rules and these are not arbitrary. I cannot imagine lying and telling my child to lie and say that they were sick when they were actually at Disney. What a terrible example that is setting, and I am sure that most young kids would feel very torn and upset at being forced to lie. What a lesson you are sending to your children -- if you don't like a rule then it is okay to lie to get around it. There is no justification for that. I love Disney as much as anyone, but deciding that the rules don't apply to me if they thwart my wants, and teaching my child to be dishonest is simply WRONG. No trip is worth that.

 

[LMHB]

But I think the heart of the matter is not whether we, as parents, are moral enough to follow rules...but whether or not the school has the RIGHT to make these overly restrictive guidelines AS IF our children are employees or property of the school. I find it very insulting that a school would presume that they know what is better for my child's welfare than I do. With the obvious exclusions of exam-times or major school projects, there is NOTHING on any given week in school that will be more remembered, cherished, or ultimately more valuable than happy time spent with your family. Not all of what children need to learn is on paper...they also need to be reminded that they are part of a family and how important it is that they have good times together. Siblings can discover that it is actually possible to get along! I know that teachers work hard, but they are also paid employees...and I will not restructure my family's plans simply to avoid having the teacher "incovenienced." Parents have the responsibility to put their FAMILY first, even in the face of annoyed teachers and educators. One reason we are doing private school is the better understanding of this. If someone is asking "how dare" we inconvenience the teacher, I ask "how dare" the school treat my child as if they own him.

 

[FredS]

Mmmmm, okay? All of the positives which can come from family trips can come from family trips taken during school breaks. No one is saying "how dare" whatever. And to try to stretch to being all self-righteous that a mere teacher's "inconvenience" is secondary to your inconsiderately planned trip? It amazes me the level of selfishness to think nothing of doubling someone else's work, breaking a rule which has logic behind it, teaching your child to be dishonest and that if you don't like a rule you can whine about it and lie. Sorry, but you are talking in circles to justify something which is based on self-centeredness and a lack of consideration for others.

BTW, teaching your kids to lie is an awfully slippery slope, isn't it? How are they supposed to know where to stop and what happens when they decide mom, the police, etc. have rules which they don't like? You might want to give that some thought, because it can (and probably will) come back to bite you on the behind. Children DO learn what they live.

 

[Bob NC]

Originally posted by LMHB
I find it very insulting that a school would presume that they know what is better for my child's welfare than I do.

You choose to send your child to public school. There ARE other options available, (Home school - Private school - Parochial schools). Once you have entrusted your childs education to them, they DO presume to know best as far as schooling your child. Would you want it any other way?....Or, do you just want them to be the experts when it is convenient for you?

Originally posted by LMHB

With the obvious exclusions of exam-times or major school projects, there is NOTHING on any given week in school that will be more remembered, cherished, or ultimately more valuable than happy time spent with your family.

Logic, then, would dictate that with a good studier like my daughter, she should only be in school during 'exam time'?

Originally posted by LMHB

Not all of what children need to learn is on paper...they also need to be reminded that they are part of a family and how important it is that they have good times together.

With the school day being roughly 6-7 hours a day, doesn't the other 17-18 hours provide quality family time?

Originally posted by LMHB

......and I will not restructure my family's plans simply to avoid having the teacher "incovenienced."

I think you look at this backwards from a lot of parents. Our families "plan" is to send our children to school to be educated. Your families "plan", is to not let the children's education get in the way of your personal convenience. I would imagine, though I may be wrong, that the school calendar is usually released before your vacation plans are made?

I also would submit that the teacher isn't the only one 'inconvenienced'. Any extra time the teacher has to put in to prepare your childs work to take with them, is time that is taken away from other students.

 

[LMHB]

In response to your post, Fred S, you should go back and READ my post. I never ONCE advocated lying to any teacher, and in fact I am strongly against that. I feel very strongly about expressing to an educator in that circumstance that I feel family time for my child is important. And a teacher "doubling" her work because my child might go to Disney World? For my ONE child (and in my case, kindergarten), "doubling" her workload by assigning additional work? I don't think so. Many teachers, though not all, work from a lesson plan which lays out their work ahead of time. They already know what they will be covering in many instances and often have worksheets, chapter assignments, etc. planned.

You too, Bob NC. Did you read my post? I don't HAVE my children in public school! Our public schools in this area are extemely strict about this! So much so that many parents are opting to put their children in year-round school, even though they don't love the concept. This is also encouraged by the county, since year-round schools are cheaper to run. I am assuming, per your screen name, that you live in NC as I do. We have chosen a private school, partially because of the propprietal attitude of the public schools in this area. And it is indeed stretching it to say that I want your daughter to only be in school during exams, that is certainly not what I said. What I did say was that excluding exams and special projects, a week was acceptable, at least to me. Don't eggagerate, please. And even though they are in school 6 - 7 hours, we have 17 - 18 hours of family time per day? Huh? When does YOUR family sleep?

These are all just philisophical differences. Some of us think the power of education should be in our own hands, some of think it should be in the hands of the teacher or school, some of us think it should blend, but to varying degrees. I guess Fred and Bob are just at a different end of the spectrum than I happen to be.

 

[FredS]

LMHB, in the first place, I was not responding to your post when I made my comments about lying. There were several prior posts by those who felt lying was perfectly acceptable. My only response to your post was that if everyone took your opinion and vacationed as they felt without regard for the education plan of their teacher/school then the teacher's workload would be greatly increased. I think your comment questioning how your child going to Disney World rather than being in school with her classmates would not doube the teacher's load is very telling. I suppose this rule would not apply to you, but would to the other families, so the teacher would only have to repeat the lessons for your child, thus it would only be a minor inconvenience which pales in comparison to your desire to do what you want when you want rather than try to accommodate the scheduled curriculum. I guess if you look at it in that [imho very skewed] way.........

 

[crazymomof4]

I included this in an earlier post but no one addressed it, so I'm repeating it. My school's attendance policy allows for a family vacation during the school year. It's in B&W, right in front of me: One such occurance per year, not to exceed 10 school days (that's 2 weeks!), parents must give 2 weeks notice, students are given time equal to amount of time missed to complete make up work. This is a public school system in NJ (not even "liberal" California). We do not live in an afluent area where parents frequently travel and could influence the school board to set this policy. Our elementary school consistantly scores in the top 20% in the annual "Report Card of the Schools" done by counties in our area. Our students score high in national testing. It seems as if the teachers are happy because many spend their entire career here.
Now, I'm sure that we are not the ONLY school district in the country w/ this type of allowance written into it's policy! I would like to invite some of the "hard-liners" who have posted such strong opinions against taking children out of school, to respond to this. If schools" know best as far as schooling your child" then why the extreme variations in school policies from district to district, state to state? Which ones actually do know what is best? Would you say that my school district doesn't care about the education of my children? OR Is my school correct and the other schools are far to stringent? OR Are the people who make up the rules and vote them in doing so based on their own personal OPINIONS, opinions which vary as much as the opinions posted within this tread. If this is true, should we treat rules based on opinions as if they are one of the 10 Commandments? Blindly follow them and never, never dare to question them? Is it still "selfish", "unfair" and "inconsiderate" to remove your child from school if the school openly allows it? If a school's scheduled curriculum is written in stone, not to be altered, then why does ours, which is seemingly written in silly putty, work for our district? I guess what I'm really asking is why so many people have such hard and fast opinions on what is right and what is wrong when it comes to this issue, when the schools themselves can't even decide?
When I take my kids out this Sept. I fully intend to "inconvenience" MYSELF to whatever degree necessary to ensure my children are caught up w/ whatever lessons are missed. Together, we will go over pages in texts, complete dittos, study for tests and yes, I will teach them if there is something they do not understand because they were not in the classroom. I have always done this for the days they missed due to illnesses. This is called being a responsible parent who is interested in and involved with my children's education. I take offense when I feel accused of being any other way, and count myself very fortunate to live within a school district that disagrees with you.
For the record: NO, I would never lie to my children's school (I can't beleive this was ever even suggested!)and while I believe some parts of WDW can be very educational I would not use this arguement to rationalize my children's abscences.

 

[disneyjunkie]

All schools, and school districts have different rules. Some public schools require students to wear uniforms some don't. Some schools allow family vacations during the school year some don't.
Some schools have an open door policy some do not.

I don't think it's a matter of one system being right or wrong. I think these policies are a result of things that have occured in the pass. If a district has a large number of students being pulled for family vacations, it makes sense to have some type of policy in place that will address the issue.

I really feel for those families that can only take vacations during the school year. I know several people that can not get time off during the summer or holidays. I agree 110% with them pulling their kids out of school.

As a teacher I have a hard time with the it's to hot to go in the summer, or the it's cheaper to go now excuses.

Each family has to do what they think is best for them. However, I don't think parents should be upset when teachers don't agree with you taking your kids out of school. If you're going to take them out, take them out, but be ready to deal with the aftermath.



I find it odd the people feel they have to spend $$$$ to have quality family time or make lasting memories with their children.

 

[sha_lyn]

I find it odd the people feel they have to spend $$$$ to have quality family time or make lasting memories with their children.

How dare you suggest that family time can be done without spending a fortune ... LOL

I find it just as odd that many feel that their family time can only come during the school yr. I really wonder if it is because the kids are shipped off to summer camp (or grandparents) all summer. I've seen that pretty often here IRL. The parents pull the kids out of school for a week or 2 in Jan or Feb. Then the kids are in summer camp all or most of the summer, while mom and dad take "their" 2 week vacation, during that time. I do know of a couple of families that, because of custody/visitation arrangements, it is hard for the parent that has to child during the school yr to plan a vacation when school is out. Other than that or an industry where it is impossible to take time off from work when scool is out, I really don't buy the "we have to take them out of school" argument.

 

[Bob NC]

Originally posted by crazymomof4
My school's attendance policy allows for a family vacation during the school year.

I would like to invite some of the "hard-liners" who have posted such strong opinions against taking children out of school, to respond to this.

Actually, my original post was not in response to any school policy. I posted after reading someone post that their son was doing, "not so good", in school, but, they were going to take him out for a WDW vacation anyway because it's more convenient to go during slower, less crowded seasons.

Schools have all kinds of policies, rules, regulations....BUT, it's up to parents to do what is right for their kids. I was merely submitting that while sometimes it's appropriate to yank a kid out of class for a family vacation, also, sometimes it's not. Apparantly, the view of the folks who do it is that it is ALWAYS appropriate to have the kids miss class for 'family time'.

I have also stated that I can see the necessity of taking family vacations during the school year IF the parents vacation schedules absolutely dictate it.

Now crazymomof4, you are asking direct questions of the 'hard-liners', so let me ask you one. No matter what the school policy, do you think it's right to take a struggling kid out of school for a week or two for a vacation?

 

[ABCMom]

I am locking this thread as I believe it has surpassed the point of being a reasonable discussion with useful information being shared and crossed into an argument with little or no chance of a pleasant outcome. If you would like to continue the discussion - you may take it to the debate board.