OK, I'll say it... we are too sensitive

[DeniseJH]

So, in your opinion, we need to go back and look at everything everyone said 50, 60, 70 years ago and obliterate them from any honor or acceptance if they said anything that was acceptable in their time but wouldn't be today? Well, I hope you have a whole bunch of road names and stadium names and library names, and building names ready to go. That's going to be a whole lot of obliterating.

We're talking about a song.

 

[Hikergirl]

At the same time, why continue to use an old version of the song when literally anyone else could sing it? It's not like it's particularly great. In fact, not having the song played at baseball games at ALL would be perfectly fine with me. There's certainly no need to play it every day like the Yankees do.

You can say it's "sensitive" but honestly, paying less attention to the casual racism of the past really shouldn't be a problem.

Except the song being played at the games isn't "casually racist"

 

[msjprincess]

Woops Sorry! I know which song is our anthem. I honestly wasn't paying attention to which song it was that this singer had done. That's on my bad for only half listening LOL and I will edit the post. The are other RECORDINGS of the song in question that could be played instead.

The OP says national anthem instead of God Bless America. I was confused before clicked on the link. Since the national anthem is performed live at Yankee stadium, not a recording.

 

[TipsyTraveler]

So, in your opinion, we need to go back and look at everything everyone said 50, 60, 70 years ago and obliterate them from any honor or acceptance if they said anything that was acceptable in their time but wouldn't be today? Well, I hope you have a whole bunch of road names and stadium names and library names, and building names ready to go. That's going to be a whole lot of obliterating.

Is that what you got from my post? Reread it. I said organizations are free to disassociate from anyone or anything they feel brings negativity or unwanted controversy to their brand. Society as a whole can make similar choices and decide certain aspects or values of previous generations are better left in the past. Individuals can make those choices as well. You may still wish to watch your Cosby Show dvd’s; someone else may be so disgusted by Cosby now knowing what we know that they can no longer stomach the show at all. If a baseball team doesn’t want to be associated with a woman because her songs don’t fit the values of their organization, so be it.

ETA: Stadiums and libraries also may want to change their names if they are no longer comfortable being associated with their namesake. There’s no rule that once associated with something or someone that must always remain the case. That’s not the same as obliterating history. This woman’s place in history is already written and nothing will change that. But some sports team isn’t obligated to keep playing her song into infinity just because that used to be the ways things were done. Change, growth, and progress — it’s what societies throughout time have always done.

 

[RedAngie]

They have been the utter definition of mediocre since the turn of the millennium. They seem to finish right around .500 year after year after year. Totally agree it's time to completely disassemble and rebuild from scratch. However, I'm still...and always will be...a fan of the Kate Smith rendition. Then to have Lauren Hart sing... When I was a kid, I never missed listening to a Flyers game. I don't know how many games I heard Gene Hart call.

Good night. Good hockey. I miss hearing him call games.

I lived in the same town as Gene Hart during my teen and young adult years. (Cherry Hill, NJ). A few times we saw him at restaurants. Several players lived in the town too. Goaltender Bernie Parent was the most famous. Second line left-wing Ross Lonsberry lived on my street for about two years before he moved to fancier digs.

 

[skyblue17]

Except the song being played at the games isn't "casually racist"

Sure. But distancing current society from the casually racist tendencies of a past society is easy to do. What's the benefit of continuing to play the Kate Smith version? Who is actually going to miss it? If they had simply stopped playing it and hadn't said why, would anyone have noticed or cared? Or do people only care because now they can complain about the reasoning? And do they actually care about the reason itself ("it's fine she sang racist songs, it was a different time!") or do they care that society is having less tolerance toward things that happened in the past that wouldn't fly today?

 

[Mackenzie Click-Mickelson]

At the same time, why continue to use an old version of the song when literally anyone else could sing it?

That's why I said I don't care what version. I'm assuming it's played out of tradition at this point. But the point being made by some is that the artist is racist due to a connection with prior songs the artist played and therefore it must go.

If it was more of breathing fresh air into it it then it would seem a lot different.

In a sense though saying there are plenty of versions to go from is kinda a half-hearted thing. There are a wide variety of songs that have been sung by many artists. I don't personally go through their life stories to figure out if I should listen to their version over another person's version but perhaps others do that.

 

[skyblue17]

The OP says national anthem instead of God Bless America. I was confused before clicked on the link. Since the national anthem is performed live at Yankee stadium, not a recording.

It's actually a recording more often than it isn't, and far more often than it is at most ballparks. Most often, it's a recording by the Marine Corps band or Robert Merrill's sung version.

 

[mrodgers]

I live outside Philadelphia. Kate Smith’s statue was covered and tied with rope on Friday. By Easter morning it was GONE....only a rust stain left on the pavement.

Even though I have been trained most of my life, at least since around 1984 when Lemieux entered the Igloo and I started watching hockey, to hate the Flyers, that is so sad.

 

[luvsJack]

Is that what you got from my post? Reread it. I said organizations are free to disassociate from anyone or anything they feel brings negativity or unwanted controversy to their brand. Society as a whole can make similar choices and decide certain aspects or values of previous generations are better left in the past. Individuals can make those choices as well. You may still wish to watch your Cosby Show dvd’s; someone else may be so disgusted by Cosby now knowing what we know that they can no longer stomach the show at all. If a baseball team doesn’t want to be associated with a woman because her songs don’t fit the values of their organization, so be it.

Sure they have the right. That doesn't mean that what the OP says isn't true. We have grown to sensitive. Of course most people today are revolted by Bill Cosby because he is being judged by people in the era he did what he did and by the standards of the time he did it in. It isn't that hard to see the difference.

But one should also point out that a baseball team taking this stance is being extremely hypocritical considering their own history.

 

[msjprincess]

It's actually a recording more often than it isn't, and far more often than it is at most ballparks. Most often, it's a recording by the Marine Corps band or Robert Merrill's sung version.

Oh okay. Every game I've been to has been live.

 

[mrodgers]

It's not about "a word" it's about the overall meaning.

Exactly and the point people are making is the overall meaning is different today than it was then.

 

[luvsJack]

Sure. But distancing current society from the casually racist tendencies of a past society is easy to do. What's the benefit of continuing to play the Kate Smith version? Who is actually going to miss it? If they had simply stopped playing it and hadn't said why, would anyone have noticed or cared? Or do people only care because now they can complain about the reasoning? And do they actually care about the reason itself ("it's fine she sang racist songs, it was a different time!") or do they care that society is having less tolerance toward things that happened in the past that wouldn't fly today?

I don't know about society, but I don't care one way or the other about Kate Smith and this song. But I do care about the fact that more and more is being erased because things through out the history of this country cannot stand up to the judgement of today's standards. What happens when its all gone? Do you really think we are suddenly going to enter this age of perfection where all is wonderful? Highly doubtful. In fact, if I was asked to guess, it would at that point that it all would start repeating itself.

 

[skyblue17]

But one should also point out that a baseball team taking this stance is being extremely hypocritical considering their own history.

I agree, baseball has a long way to go in a lot areas, which is why any steps they take at all are better than none for me. They put their foot in their mouth relatively often so at least with each step back, they attempt to move forward, at least lately.

 

[Mackenzie Click-Mickelson]

If they had simply stopped playing it and hadn't said why, would anyone have noticed or cared?

Well I'm sure after playing for as long as they have they felt the need to rationalize it to others; they probably would have gotten a lot of flack if they hadn't.

I'm seeing this more of them weighing the pros and cons once they were notified (which was it even said how they were notified?) of keeping it. Preemptively removing the version and covering up traces of the artist's likeness while stating the reasoning why they likely saw it as a positive PR vibe. If it later came out that there could be a connection made by some it may have been seen as bad PR. That aspect is part of our current lens we look at things (good or bad).

 

[skyblue17]

I don't know about society, but I don't care one way or the other about Kate Smith and this song. But I do care about the fact that more and more is being erased because things through out the history of this country cannot stand up to the judgement of today's standards. What happens when its all gone? Do you really think we are suddenly going to enter this age of perfection where all is wonderful? Highly doubtful. In fact, if I was asked to guess, it would at that point that it all would start repeating itself.

What's erased? Kate Smith still existed, her music is still available to listen to. We absolutely are not going to enter into an age of perfection, because there are still a lot of people in the world who don't care if they hurt or offend others. Some like to make a point of it.

 

[Hikergirl]

Sure. But distancing current society from the casually racist tendencies of a past society is easy to do. What's the benefit of continuing to play the Kate Smith version? Who is actually going to miss it? If they had simply stopped playing it and hadn't said why, would anyone have noticed or cared? Or do people only care because now they can complain about the reasoning? And do they actually care about the reason itself ("it's fine she sang racist songs, it was a different time!") or do they care that society is having less tolerance toward things that happened in the past that wouldn't fly today?

I personally don't care what song anyone chooses to play.
I'm just shaking my head at the need for some to be offended. If you are searching 50 years in the past for it, then you've got issues.

I's love to know just how many people, and fans actually knew about this woman's horrible racist past (that's sarcasm BTW) yesterday? Or did they just get to their seats, barely pay attention to the song and enjoy the game they were watching?
Yeah, "sensitive" is putting it nicely

 

[luvsJack]

What's erased? Kate Smith still existed, her music is still available to listen to. We absolutely are not going to enter into an age of perfection, because there are still a lot of people in the world who don't care if they hurt or offend others. Some like to make a point of it.

But this woman is dead. She isn't here to hurt anyone's feelings or say anything offensive and whoever had to go back 50 years to find when she did! And taking down statues or removing recordings that is traditional used is in fact erasing.

 

[luvsJack]

I agree, baseball has a long way to go in a lot areas, which is why any steps they take at all are better than none for me. They put their foot in their mouth relatively often so at least with each step back, they attempt to move forward, at least lately.

When Kate Smith sang the offensive song, black were not allowed in the MLB. I am not talking about anything they do today. If we want to go back and erase, lets start with anything pertaining to any professional sports before minorities were allowed to play.

 

[Scifidiner]

Can't we all just get along?