DVC Club Level and Home Resort Survey

[Sandisw]

With the above predictions and comment about it being a slow process that might take 10+ years to really gain steam; 2043 would be a very big year for the Trust. There would be so many new resorts added.

Which is why this idea may have come about? Planning for how to handle the expiring resorts. Once those go back to DVD, then can just be repackaged all under a trust and stay open…with current owners at resorts still in existence being able to access via BVTC.

 

[Disdreaming479]

Plus, they can effectively reduce the resale market tremendously in 20 years. If trust buyers want out of their contracts, the trust will just take them back and resell over and over. The resale market for trust points would be devalued(?) similar to current trust timeshare systems. (I’m completely out of the loop on them besides being available for free.)

 

[ehh]

With the above predictions and comment about it being a slow process that might take 10+ years to really gain steam; 2043 would be a very big year for the Trust. There would be so many new resorts added.

I think one of the natural byproducts of a Trust, almost regardless of implementation details, is that they'll be more open about what resorts are coming next because talking about The Next Big Thing is an inducement for Trust sales today. They can capitalize on excitement at any time.

As for 2042, I think they're salivating at the opportunity to flip BWV/BCV/BRV, juice/modernize the points charts, and sell anew (with the appropriate mix of Units into the Trust) for big, big bucks. But maybe they put one or two of the resorts into the Trust for a few years to stagger the sales/release? Maybe HHI and VRB go into the trust permanently. No idea about OKW and its 2042/2057 problem.

 

[AnnaKristoff2013]

Not more access but the trust would put more pressure on the system than individual owners during peak demand seasons would.

I don't think the trust would put more pressure on the system than already exists between the board sponsor & David's commercially renting spec reservations.

 

[AnnaKristoff2013]

But that's what I mean. If they have a limited number of points at a resort, people would book a reservation on the first day of the UY, and walk it to ensure they have access to those points when they want to travel.

I don't think that'll work because the trust would be unlikely to allocate all of the points to the very first day of every use year, so your walk could easily break month to month. In addition, the variability in points will break a lot of walks, because it's no longer day availability you're walking against, it's points availability.

 

[Sandisw]

Plus, they can effectively reduce the resale market tremendously in 20 years. If trust buyers want out of their contracts, the trust will just take them back and resell over and over. The resale market for trust points would be devalued(?) similar to current trust timeshare systems. (I’m completely out of the loop on them besides being available for free.)

And, the paperwork filed indicates that they very well may be putting restrictions on contracts when sold resale.

 

[Sandisw]

I don't think that'll work because the trust would be unlikely to allocate all of the points to the very first day of every use year, so your walk could easily break month to month. In addition, the variability in points will break a lot of walks, because it's no longer day availability you're walking against, it's points availability.

But once you have secured your reservation with a set of points, those would be yours to use and move forward wouldn’t they?

 

[tidefan]

And, the paperwork filed indicates that they very well may be putting restrictions on contracts when sold resale.

I would imagine there would be language in there as well about surrendering points back to the trust. In that case, Disney wouldn't even need to deal with resale and ROFR...

 

[dioxide45]

Plus, they can effectively reduce the resale market tremendously in 20 years. If trust buyers want out of their contracts, the trust will just take them back and resell over and over. The resale market for trust points would be devalued(?) similar to current trust timeshare systems. (I’m completely out of the loop on them besides being available for free.)

DVC would have to reaquire them first. There is no reason there isn't a resale market for trust points.

 

[dioxide45]

And, the paperwork filed indicates that they very well may be putting restrictions on contracts when sold resale.

What all has been filed? I only see the two documents at Sunbiz and those are only articles of incorporation for the trust association and I didn't really see anything in there that mentioned resale restrictions.

 

[dioxide45]

I would imagine there would be language in there as well about surrendering points back to the trust. In that case, Disney wouldn't even need to deal with resale and ROFR...

Depending on how they set it up, the trust points could also be deeded interests recorded in Orange County FL. That is how Marriott Vacation Club handles their trust product. Those deeded interests are bought and sold just like regular real estate and is subject to ROFR.

 

[hhisc16]

I think one of the natural byproducts of a Trust, almost regardless of implementation details, is that they'll be more open about what resorts are coming next because talking about The Next Big Thing is an inducement for Trust sales today. They can capitalize on excitement at any time.

As for 2042, I think they're salivating at the opportunity to flip BWV/BCV/BRV, juice/modernize the points charts, and sell anew (with the appropriate mix of Units into the Trust) for big, big bucks. But maybe they put one or two of the resorts into the Trust for a few years to stagger the sales/release? Maybe HHI and VRB go into the trust permanently. No idea about OKW and its 2042/2057 problem.

The trust may keep VBR and HHI into the DVC portfolio, since it offers East Coast beach destinations after 2042. Plus the high dues would be mixed in with the other resorts for "trust dues"

 

[AnnaKristoff2013]

But once you have secured your reservation with a set of points, those would be yours to use and move forward wouldn’t they?

Maybe? One of the problems is that the other systems that have trusts don't allow "walking" so it's hard to know how Disney would set this up. In Wyndham the only modification you can make to a reservation is adding up to two days to the front and back end of a reservation. Any more than that and you have to cancel and rebook (and risk losing the reservation to waitlists, people with fast fingers who are stalking, etc.). If Disney doesn't change anything and continues to allow walking by Trust members it's hard to say whether they'd let you use points that were allocated to a particular month into the next month. I think they could probably set the system up either way.

I think if Disney was smart they'd copy Wyndham here too and restrict modifications enough so that they put an end to walking, at least by Trust members.

 

[AnnaKristoff2013]

And, the paperwork filed indicates that they very well may be putting restrictions on contracts when sold resale.

I read that differently. It looked like the two "classes" of owners were Disney itself versus people who buy into the trust, but I guess it could be read the way you are reading it.

 

[walt34]

I don't think the trust would put more pressure on the system than already exists between the board sponsor & David's commercially renting spec reservations.

I believe many more current owners would have to rent out their points for this to be true. Currently it's a tiny subset of owners who do that.

 

[cdirazonian]

But once you have secured your reservation with a set of points, those would be yours to use and move forward wouldn’t they?

I think if Disney was smart they'd copy Wyndham here too and restrict modifications enough so that they put an end to walking, at least by Trust members.

same kind of thing with Marriott you have to cancel the reservation to use those pts. elsewhere. There is no modifying available online. You no longer have access to them and can only cancel the reservation online..then try to rebook something else. Not really worth the risk of losing the reservation you have. Disney could do something like this to get rid of walkers in the trust side.

 

[AnnaKristoff2013]

Disney could do something like this to get rid of walkers in the trust side.

Disney should probably do something like this anyway, for both trust and non-trust users, but that's another discussion.

 

[wiihoo888]

Disney should probably do something like this anyway, for both trust and non-trust users, but that's another discussion.

That would be one thing I’m completely onboard with!

 

[Sandisw]

What all has been filed? I only see the two documents at Sunbiz and those are only articles of incorporation for the trust association and I didn't really see anything in there that mentioned resale restrictions.

There is a clause in there…I posted it on an earlier thread.. It said that there may be restrictions on transfer of membership, including needing the trust boards approval.

While it doesn’t outline them, it’s clear they are giving themselves the option to impose them in some way.

 

[mkatsy]

Oh no doubt that’s what would likely happen, especially for the most popular rooms. It’s why I’m happy to have my home resorts and deeded interests and it’s very unlikely I’d ever join this type of program.

But I guess what I meant by it doesn’t seem so awful is that based on DVD and POS rules and regulations, the pools of points/rooms available to the trust and the existing system will be separate and so as long as they don’t mess with that, it won’t be too bad. At least that’s how I’m understanding it.

I can’t shake feeling more than the Trust will be introduced in 2024. DVC portal changes may not be limited to the trust addition. They can point to member feedback when it comes to walking or spec rental business. The Trust gives them more reason to care if it improves their product and cuts out some of their competition. Next year we’ll see.

doesn't our POS say that resort swapping is not guaranteed? What if they were to restrict legacy DVC to home resort only. What options do they have to control that? Can they exempt themselves and allow the trust points to be swapped. They would instantly be the prettiest girl at the dance.