This one has it all (Outback firing)

[Colleen27]

Honestly if my job told me that reporting something illegal meant I was written out of the schedule that would make me even more determined to make a complaint. You could have also tried for unemployment on the basis of a hostile work environment should you have left

That's all very nice in theory, but not so much in practice when you need the job. DH has worked for several companies that violate labor law with impunity, and there's a reason they do so - they know the odds of facing any consequences are slim to none. At one, even the guy shoveling the snow had a managerial title and was classified as exempt - no overtime, just comp time that couldn't actually be taken because employers have such wide latitude on setting rules for it. And I know former employers have tried to make complaints, but I don't think any actually went anywhere or they'd have changed their policies. DH never did because he needed the paycheck - he just toughed it out while looking for work elsewhere.

Complaints aren't anonymous. You have to give your name and details of the violation for an investigation to take place. But don't worry - the same labor laws the employer was violating in the first place are there to protect you from being fired in retaliation.

 

[Nancyg56]

It suppose it's going to be more confusing trying to figure out who makes what.

We should have some way of knowing, perhaps.

In this case, though, from the first article:

"Servers, especially at casual chain restaurants, typically make less than the minimum wage, and the difference is made up by tips. Florida’s minimum wage is $8.25 an hour, but the tipped minimum wage is $5.23.

Yoder said that because she spent so much time working on the carryout order, she couldn’t tend to other tables, and made only $18 in tips that day."

Employers are required to make up the difference and if they do not the fines and penalties are enormous.

Employee in fast food establishment: Not a tipped position. Makes at least minimum wage.

Server in a table service restaurant: Tipped position. Their wage paid by the employer is nowhere near minimum wage.

Big, BIG difference.

But the server must make minimum. It is the law.

So in FL waitstaff will make minimum wage?

Yes.

@starry_solo is correct. By law, employers that take advantage of the Federal Tip Credit are supposed to make up the difference, but in practice I have never seen this happen. I've worked in family run restaurants and global corporate brands -- none of them would've ever considered actually coming out of pocket to follow the law on that one. For the ones who even cared enough to keep up appearances that their employees were never falling below the minimum, they would do some creative bookkeeping. I.e., the server didn't claim enough in tips one week to meet minimum wage so the manager has them sign a form that will be submitted to corporate saying the employee made an error and they actually did earn enough, or the server is made to claim more than they earned the following week to make up for the shortage the previous week.

I have distinct memories of coworkers getting yelled at by management for not claiming enough in tips. It didn't matter how much you actually earned so long as you claimed enough to clear the minimum. It was the kind of thing you could get fired for, so if you wanted to keep your job you made sure to clear the minimum wage in what you claimed, regardless if you actually earned that much. That's for the larger restaurants/chains who were concerned with things like record keeping and audits. Mostly though, that law is just completely ignored. The restaurant industry is as shady as they come.

I run payroll and my businesses must have a built in tip makeup or I won't take them on. There was just penalty gif a restaurant that violated the law and it was stunning. I have one employer who had made a drastic change when I earned her about the Consequences. Employees can report violations to the states attorney general.

 

[Mackenzie Click-Mickelson]

That's all very nice in theory, but not so much in practice when you need the job. DH has worked for several companies that violate labor law with impunity, and there's a reason they do so - they know the odds of facing any consequences are slim to none. At one, even the guy shoveling the snow had a managerial title and was classified as exempt - no overtime, just comp time that couldn't actually be taken because employers have such wide latitude on setting rules for it. And I know former employers have tried to make complaints, but I don't think any actually went anywhere or they'd have changed their policies. DH never did because he needed the paycheck - he just toughed it out while looking for work elsewhere.

Complaints aren't anonymous. You have to give your name and details of the violation for an investigation to take place. But don't worry - the same labor laws the employer was violating in the first place are there to protect you from being fired in retaliation.

Of course people gotta do what they gotta do but like I said seeking unemployment benefits is an option especially if encouraged and required to do something illegal-that would put the company also on the map for scrutiny. I was talking specifically about the person's experience regarding their tips. I'm guessing that for servers unless you're in a smaller town there is probably somewhere else with a similar position (pay may be different). Practices can't change if no one at least tries to do something about it. The PP did state that they make a complaint after the left the company which is good.

 

[disneymom3]

It's my understanding that most chain restaurants don't have dedicated workers to package take-out orders; a regular tipped server handles the duties. I've never ordered take-out from such places, but I'd tip if I ever do so in the future. Perhaps not 15-20%, but probably at least 10%.

At Outback, waitstaff is assigned to the ToGo section on a rotating basis so they don't have any tables that shift. The only tips they get are from car side. The cook gives them the food on reg plates. They place it into boxes, gather plastic wear, napkins, bag the order etc.

I think people assume that servers everywhere make below minimum but that isn't true everywhere. In MN and CA, they make reg min wage. I thought I had read that's the case in NY too. I am sure other states are the same.

 

[MIGrandma]

Employers are required to make up the difference and if they do not the fines and penalties are enormous.



But the server must make minimum. It is the law.



Yes.



I run payroll and my businesses must have a built in tip makeup or I won't take them on. There was just penalty gif a restaurant that violated the law and it was stunning. I have one employer who had made a drastic change when I earned her about the Consequences. Employees can report violations to the states attorney general.

It may be the law, but it isn’t always followed. I was a server for many years, thankfully the less than minimum wage nights were few. Occasionally happened on a really bad winter night. Most shifts were much, much better otherwise I wouldn’t have worked there for so many years.

My former boss’s husband is an accountant and had his office in the back of the restaurant. He probably knew a loop-hole so they didn’t have to make up the minimum wage difference on the rare occasions it happened.

 

[dreamin_disney]

-I don't agree with her posting on facebook. Can the Church go after her for making them look bad?
-I'm glad she was fired(ok maybe not fired but she should have been disciplined). One should not bad mouth customers on social media and if they do they need to be prepared for consequence or backlash from it. I didn't realized outback has a no posting on social media policy so she new there would be a consequence
-I don't think she deserved a tip. Its her job to put the orders together. If she didn't want to she should have complained to her manager. Many times I see school athletes on buss loads going to McDonalds or fast food after an away game....McDonald workers have to bag all those orders and theres no tip. All the waitress had to do was bag the food. the cooks did all the hard work
-I don't think to go orders should be a mandatory tip, that's just like the local doughnut shop or lil food places with tips jars. All they do is take your order. bag it and hand it to you

Now before anyone ask if we tip....
Hubby and I went to ihop for breakfast. the waitress is an older lady. She had several tables compare to the younger waitress. Let me tell you the older lady was husling getting food out. The younger was super slower and way behind. Older lady was on it and even put in an extra order for pancakes to go for us even though we hadn't touched our pancakes(all you can eat. She could tell we were full and were going to ask for a to go box. Before we could ask she brought 2 to go boxes with two pancakes in each box to go and says heres a box for your pancakes and 2 extra to go and gave us a wink and a smile. I made sure that's hubby tipped her very well. Now not only did she earn her tip , she deserved it. She took very good care of us and all her customers

 

[luvsJack]

It may be the law, but it isn’t always followed. I was a server for many years, thankfully the less than minimum wage nights were few. Occasionally happened on a really bad winter night. Most shifts were much, much better otherwise I wouldn’t have worked there for so many years.

My former boss’s husband is an accountant and had his office in the back of the restaurant. He probably knew a loop-hole so they didn’t have to make up the minimum wage difference on the rare occasions it happened.

There is no loop hole. But if you were making enough over the week to make your hours up to minimum, then they were legal.

 

[Tuffcookie]

The server knew the employer’s rules regarding not posting on social media. If she had issues with the church not tipping she should have talked with a manager about it. I know if you eat inside a restaurant, you are billed a mandatory tip for a larger number in your party. Maybe restaurants need to implement a mandatory “tip” for carry-out orders in excess of $100. Ten percent would be reasonable. I have a sister who has been a waitress for many years so I sympathize with those who do this line of work.

TC

 

[Nancyg56]

It may be the law, but it isn’t always followed. I was a server for many years, thankfully the less than minimum wage nights were few. Occasionally happened on a really bad winter night. Most shifts were much, much better otherwise I wouldn’t have worked there for so many years.

My former boss’s husband is an accountant and had his office in the back of the restaurant. He probably knew a loop-hole so they didn’t have to make up the minimum wage difference on the rare occasions it happened.

There is no loophole. The server must make minimum wage, however the tips and the tipped wage are averaged out over the period. Employers may try to break labor laws, but if employees report them, there are consequences. One company I know of is out of business, however the States Attorney General has gone back over three years becuase there was a report of a labor violation.

AS a payroll specialists working in an accounting firm, it is my responsibility to be sure my employers are following the law. While I cannot babysit them outside of my office, I insist that we follow the law in terms of tip make up, not charging for breakage, or mistakes on checks, etc. WHat they do that they do share with me, I cannot say, but I do warn them that if they choose to break these laws they run a very high risk of an investigation and penalties. I will not let them run anything through payroll that is not allowed.

 

[Kellykins1218]

Nope, sorry, not tipping on takeout.

 

[PollyannaMom]

Takeout orders - to tip, or not to tip?

I generally tip on take-out (especially if they bring it to my car) - but not the full 20% that I likely would if eating in. I feel they're doing more than just ringing up my order, but not as much as if they were checking on me throughout the meal.

I don't really like the idea of a mandatory percent tip on large parties, as I think the original point of tipping is that it goes up and down with quality of service. But I do actually think it would be more logical if the socially conventional "starting point" for figuring tips had more to do with an amount per person than a percent of total bill. - It takes my server no more time to carry a steak to my table than it does a hamburger, so he or she is taking care of me for the same amount of time no matter which I order. (I would expect that per-person scale to be higher at fancy places than casual ones, though.)

I would also be OK with a "catering fee" rather than a tipping expectation on huge take-out orders like this.

Facebook - to complain about work, or not to complain?

Beyond "work was tiring today" absolutely not!

Servers' wages relying on tips

I wish they didn't. If everyone was paid fairly, this whole tipping debate would go away.

But since that isn't likely to happen quickly, I do think the server got the raw end of the deal. Because she was working on this order, other servers likely got assigned all the eat-in parties that came in while she was busy, and she did miss out on tips. (But at the same time, I think a $130 tip is too much to expect on one order.)

Church spending - ? extravagant

Who knows? It could have been a huge party for the retirement of a long-time employee, planned and saved for over a long period. (But again, it should have been processed as a catering order, not as take-out.)

Who did what in the aftermath

Manager was wrong to leave that to one person.
Employee was wrong to name names on social media.
Church is very kind to help her find a new job.

Should Outback have refunded the cost of the church's takeout meal?

Not necessary. Probably done to head off backlash over what they were afraid would appear as Outback bad-mouthing the church.

Do you need education on tipping?

Not a forced one.

But I do find threads like this informative. (I didn't know, for instance, about some of the minimum wage differences mentioned.)

Who likes Outback, anyway?

Eh - I don't have one near me now, but have been to one in the past. Some things were nothing special, some were really good, and I don't remember any problems with servers. So I guess I like it OK.