Am I the only one annoyed by the "free upgrade" happening?

[minnie61650]

If the "marketing" angle was indeed their intention, wouldn't it make more sense to upgrade families staying in moderates? One would think that if someone were willing and financially able to spend $30-40 more a night for a little nicer accommodations, they would be the better DVC customer.........
.

I disagree.

I do not think that someone who stays a mod is necessary a better candidate to buy a DVC than someone who stays at a value.

The values are very child friendly and geared toward young children.
Many young families who would like to vacation at Disney yearly will be staying at a value resort.

Also many wealthy people stay at the values.
there is a very interesting book titled :The Millionaire Next Door: by Thomas J. Stanley,William D. Danko.
It explains why so many wealthy choose to be frugal with their income.

I know we have a high income and value is where we usually choose to stay. Our children are grown and I need a room that has a roll in shower. The values have very large HA bathrooms and the entrances of the values are much more handicapped friendly. I am able to get in and out of my All Star room unassisted. This way my husband can go and play a round of golf and know I can leave my room to relax by the pool if I choose.

The Deluxe rooms have a narrow hall with the bath on one side and closet on the other. I cannot open the door from the inside unassisted.

Here is thread that talks about why people choose different levels of Disney resorts and for the most part the resort choice is NOT based on persons income.

Annual income of deluxe guests vs. moderate vs. economy...

http://www.disboards.com/showthread.php?t=1428659

Have fun planning your next Disney vacation!

 

[DVC Grammy]

As someone who usually flies on SWA, I've never thought to feel guilty about snagging a $24/OW ticket to MCO, even though the person next to me might have paid $100+ more for the same flight. I was just lucky to be in the right place , at the right time.
I imagine those folks who got upgraded feel the same.

 

[Chuck S]

This doesn't make sense. I understand what you're saying, but consider this. These are unsold/undeclared rooms, granted. So, what's the difference if Disney gives an upgrade to an undeclared 1 BR to a guest at POP or to a DVC member? As a matter of fact, giving that room to a NON DVC member oversells the resort, because if they upgrade me, they've got my old room to rebook. Not the case when you bring someone in from outside the resort.

It makes perfect sense. Those folks are upgraded to non-DVC rooms. If DVC members were upgraded to non-DVC rooms, Disney would need to be paid for them by DVC, thus increasing our dues.

If DVCers were upgraded from a studio in DVC inventory to a one bedroom in DVC inventory, then there would not be enough rooms to fulfill the legal obligation of not overselling the resort, as that would then not have the number of rooms theoretically available for every point sold at that home resort.

If I paid $160 a head to dine at Victoria & Alberts, and I found out that the people sitting next to me were just at the ABC Commissary and Disney upgraded them to dine at V&A for $10 a head, I'd be upset. Sure, they're Disney's restaurants to use as they wish. Doesn't mean I wouldn't be put off.

Again, why? Do you feel the same way if someone uses a coupon, or gets a much better deal on airfare than you? Wow, I just paid $3.50 for a jar or peanut butter, and the lady next to me had a coupon for a free jar...I'm upset.

If a person belongs to an exclusive golf club that they paid tens of thousands of dollars to join and hundreds or thousands of dollars each year to maintain and the club owners decide that they're going to go and pick up random people playing at a public course and let them play, I would expect a similar reaction. However, there would probably be no reaction at all if they invited people from other exclusive golf clubs over to play in hopes to join.

Is it classist or elitist? Maybe, maybe not. Really, what's the difference between an exclusive golf club vs. a public course? Maybe the grounds are a little nicer, or the bar is a little better. But, are you paying $30k for a little nicer accomodations? Nope. You're paying $30k to be around like-minded and like-meansed people.

DVC is similar. If we've got the money to shell out for a DVC membership, I'm sure we all could stay at any resort we chose. But, we chose to spend tens of thousands of dollars to be in an EXCLUSIVE club. That's what exclusive means - it excludes people. I don't see Disney giving out free upgrades into Club 33 - that's also an exclusive club.

But since when was DVC marketed as an "exclusive, elitist timeshare?" It is marketed as a pre-paid, frugal, saving $$ in the long run vacation plan, nothing more...exclusive seems to be "your" understanding of pre-paying for your vacations. And again, these rooms are NOT DVC rooms, they are Disney controlled rooms, which is spelled out in our documentation. Unfortunately, some folks don't fully understand what their membership actually is...a timeshare, prepaid vacation plan...not a classist or elitist club membership. BTW, just because people stay at POP or All Stars does not necessarily mean they don't have $$$, it means they may be frugal. And DVC is marketed as a way to save money on accomodations.

If you spent tens of thousands of $$$ on DVC just to be in an "exclusive" club with "like-minded and like-meansed people" you threw your $$ away. DVC is not the Four Seasons.

 

[ldo]

1 easy transaction---I bet they reasoned almost everyone who was in Value would upgrade, and not quibble whether it's OKW or SSR or studio or 1 BR--and they instantly freed up Values (where the demand was) for the last 2 weeks of free DDP promotion. Any other upgrades entail less response, more quibbling, and/or more CM transaction time.
Ex--to upgrade DVC studios to 1 BR, then offer only studios to hotel guests involves more time and more transactions---b/c they have to complete the DVC upgrade before offering to hotel guests. Upgrades from deluxe would get lesser response--some want Poly for the monorail and the doller difference is more of a wash. Similar for moderates--not as much of a slam-dunk, no-brainer decision--they obviously chose a mod over value for a reason--the partidcular pool, decor, etc.
so, I think "Value-DVC" was an easy, quick plan--and it worked for Disney to free up more rooms and "give" all those folks a special dream--and maybe sell some DVC--but I do think Disney did not consider the internet and these BB and all the uproar from DVC owners--so, I think it backfired on them, in the end, from a DVC PR standpoint.

 

[tasha99]

1 easy transaction---I bet they reasoned almost everyone who was in Value would upgrade, and not quibble whether it's OKW or SSR or studio or 1 BR--and they instantly freed up Values (where the demand was) for the last 2 weeks of free DDP promotion. Any other upgrades entail less response, more quibbling, and/or more CM transaction time.
Ex--to upgrade DVC studios to 1 BR, then offer only studios to hotel guests involves more time and more transactions---b/c they have to complete the DVC upgrade before offering to hotel guests. Upgrades from deluxe would get lesser response--some want Poly for the monorail and the doller difference is more of a wash. Similar for moderates--not as much of a slam-dunk, no-brainer decision--they obviously chose a mod over value for a reason--the partidcular pool, decor, etc.
so, I think "Value-DVC" was an easy, quick plan--and it worked for Disney to free up more rooms and "give" all those folks a special dream--and maybe sell some DVC--but I do think Disney did not consider the internet and these BB and all the uproar from DVC owners--so, I think it backfired on them, in the end, from a DVC PR standpoint.

I agree that it was done for Disney's convenience. Can you imagine if they'd upgraded the deluxes to DVC, the moderates to deluxe, then the values to moderate? They'd have to go all the way down, domino style to open up those values, so it would have been a logistical nightmare from the call center's point of view.

And I have to second almost all of what Chuck S. said. This is going to tick some people off, but I'm going to go ahead and say it: I pay full price for almost nothing because I use coupons, try to be at the right place at the right time, and monitor the ads carefully. I found the free dining promotion here on the Disboards, and I watch other boards like fatwallet, slickdeals.net, and the bargain boards at dvdtalk for other deals. The restaurant scenario where one person pays less than another? Entertainment coupon book or restaurant . com. The airplane scenario? Ding fares. Or hey--I got upgraded to first class once on a trans-Pacific flight because I spoke Korean with the guy at check in and he thought I was cute. (ah . . .my younger days) People don't pay the same price for houses, cars, travel--all kinds of things, so why is this any different?

 

[Anthony1971]

Because they are not selling timeshares at GF. Disney's incentive for these upgrades is to get these people to buy DVC. I had no intention of buying DVC until I stayed in a room at OKW with a member friend. I was instantly hooked. So why leave rooms at SSR empty when they can use them as a sales tactic. Sort of a "trial membership". It would be interesting to see how many of the people take the DVC tour (I'm sure they will be invited to) and how many buy. Disney's motive is not "generosity".

Consider that a septmeber weekday in a studio at OKW when I use a simple method of dividing what I paid and my dues for that year costs me under $50.00 a night they are targeting the right people... even adding interest and all it will be less than a value... free dinning will not be around forever...

I think Dinsey resorts are based on a calss system and that can be willing to pay and affording to pay --there are many people who have a lot more $ than they show and many who have a lot less $ than they spend..... that said a lot people satying in a value today will be satying in a deluxe tomorrow as it seems money and willing to pay for that something extra comes at some point......

For the most part it seems owners here were concerned about who is paying for the extra costs....which is the whole value-mod-deluxe upgrade issue.. most understand they do not truly own...we have no control... etc... but we do have an ownership and responsability for upkeep and some will certianly take an interest in what is going on....and there are a lot of concerns.. But none of this is saying any guest in any resort is better...it simple says we have a concern and want to understand......and there have been a lot of good explinations and some bad ones... a least for my questions
everyone who owns a car takes an interest in gas prices it is the same here....

 

[Anthony1971]

And I have to second almost all of what Chuck S. said. This is going to tick some people off, but I'm going to go ahead and say it: I pay full price for almost nothing because I use coupons, try to be at the right place at the right time, and monitor the ads carefully. I found the free dining promotion here on the Disboards, and I watch other boards like fatwallet, slickdeals.net, and the bargain boards at dvdtalk for other deals. The restaurant scenario where one person pays less than another? Entertainment coupon book or restaurant . com. The airplane scenario? Ding fares. Or hey--I got upgraded to first class once on a trans-Pacific flight because I spoke Korean with the guy at check in and he thought I was cute. (ah . . .my younger days) People don't pay the same price for houses, cars, travel--all kinds of things, so why is this any different?

This is why a lot of bought DVC

 

[calypso*a*go-go]

I just noticed a thread on the Rumors Board where someone was told by a CM that the unfinished Legendary Years @ POP are going to be a DVC. Let's think about this for a minute -- is this something that could really happen, and could that have anything to do with the recent upgrades? I know it sounds totally far-fetched but you never know...

http://www.disboards.com/showthread.php?t=1496130

 

[Chuck S]

I just noticed a thread on the Rumors Board where someone was told by a CM that the unfinished Legendary Years @ POP are going to be a DVC. Let's think about this for a minute -- is this something that could really happen, and could that have anything to do with the recent upgrades? I know it sounds totally far-fetched but you never know...

http://www.disboards.com/showthread.php?t=1496130

Actually, I like the general location of Pop Century, it is located fairly close to MGM & EPCOT without being "right on top of" the parks. As far a whether this is a feasible location for DVC, who knows. The check-in building and food service area are already built, and could be modified to include a table service location without a lot of hassle. The rest of the area could be redesigned to nice DVC units, and the existing, unused guest room buildings could be absorbed in to the current POP inventory or maybe redesigned into all studios fairly inexpensively.

The problem I see is that DVC resorts generally have much nicer pool areas and free laundry facilities, and with the existing connecting bridge to POP Century, I see a potential problem. And if the value resorts are as popular as they seem to be (I couldn't get a room at POP for a couple nights recently, I had to take All Stars ) I think it would best serve Disney's interest to finish the resort as originally designed., except maybe to add a few of the "value" mini suites for families.

 

[TenThousandVolts]

The problem I see is that DVC resorts generally have much nicer pool areas and free laundry facilities, and with the existing connecting bridge to POP Century, I see a potential problem. And if the value resorts are as popular as they seem to be (I couldn't get a room at POP for a couple nights recently, I had to take All Stars ) I think it would best serve Disney's interest to finish the resort as originally designed., except maybe to add a few of the "value" mini suites for families.

Good points- Maybe this could be a new frontier for DVC- varying levels of DVCs including value DVCs Already I feel like SSR and OKW are kind of like mods compared to the more deluxe BCV/VWL/BWV- this is reflected in the rack rate prices for rooms at these resorts. At the value DVCs maybe they just wouldn't get the free laundry and the great pool.

 

[calypso*a*go-go]

I could see them getting by with charging for laundry and having a less than stellar pool area with lower point requirements per night. With special promos you can already get rooms for as little as $56/night @ POP...so a DVC studio-type room would need to be 6-7pts. night. The larger accomodations would include the washer/dryer so it wouldn't be an issue. Actually, the more I think about the idea, it isn't as unreasonable as I originally thought. Why not make them into family suites similar to AllStars, but allow them to be booked with points. This could be an even more affordable option for families with more than two children or large groups traveling together.

 

[Deb & Bill]

How about this one? I only paid about $50 a point for my first 175 points. How do you AKV owners feel about that? You're paying more than twice what I paid for your points.

Really, though, folks, some of us DVC members are sounding like we're needing a little cheese to go with the whine.

Anybody want to spend a night in the Cinderella Castle? It's free!!

 

[IndianaMouseLover]

Anybody want to spend a night in the Cinderella Castle? It's free!!

I sure would love to spend a night in Cinderella's Castle. But then again I am NEVER lucky enough to win something like that.

 

[BuzznBelle'smom]

I said this several pages pages back, but I'll say it again--I think they're trying to get the POP-ers used to the concept of suites. It makes more sense to have Legendary Years be suites than it does to make it DVC. POP isn't deluxe enough to have the DVC image. Sure, they could do some stuff--add a restaurant, keep low points requirements, etc. but it could potentially drag down the deluxe DVC image.

If they can get POP families used to the idea of suites, and then offer them with fewer amenities than DVC at a pre-night price, they could fill up Legendary years. I will tell you, as a family of 6, WDW has really limited options for our size family. Surprisingly, they offer a lot for the traditional family of 4, but if you have more than that, you dont' have many choices. I was fortunate to come into some money that we decided would benefit our family by joining DVC (Thanks, MOM! )

 

[rayelias]

So, is OKW and SSR worth $300/night rack rate or $85/night including free dining?

Again, I submit that Disney is cheapening the DVC brand by upgrading from value to DVC.

I've always equated my DVC accommodations and experience to a deluxe, NOT a value. That's why, IMHO, they charge so much for rack rate. And, that's why I paid so much to join DVC. And there's a reason why OKW & SSR are $300+ a night and attracts people who want that experience, and there's a reason why All Stars is $85 a night (including free dining).

I don't think it's a good thing to blurry the difference between the two, because what will happen is not bringing All Stars up to DVC, rather lowering DVC to value.



ETA: Again, just to be clear, when I stay at WDW for cash, I stay at Value, so I'm not looking down on anyone or anything. There is (overall) a distinct difference in the people, in the feel, in the cast members, etc. between the resort categories. If you don't believe me, just for fun, take a ride on a Grand Floridian Bus, then take a ride on a All Stars Bus. You'll notice a different feel.

I certainly wouldn't pay extra to join DVC if it offered the "value experience." I did pay extra (with two add-ons) to join the DVC where I was surrounded by people who either paid $300+ a night to be there, or tens of thousands of dollars to be there. You take that out, and OKW & SSR are nothing more than Pop Century with kitcheonettes.

 

[robinb]

I just noticed a thread on the Rumors Board where someone was told by a CM that the unfinished Legendary Years @ POP are going to be a DVC. Let's think about this for a minute -- is this something that could really happen, and could that have anything to do with the recent upgrades? I know it sounds totally far-fetched but you never know...

http://www.disboards.com/showthread.php?t=1496130

My first visceral response to this was: "No way would I buy into POP DVC!". And I love Pop Century! My second thought was ... hmmm ... "Maybe I would stay there if the point rates were very, very low. Half that of OKW or SSR.". Maybe there is a place for a "value" DVC! But I also see a serious problem with regular POP guests using DVC facilities (pool, laundry, etc). Honestly, I am surprised that there are not more BWI and BC guests who use the free DVC laundry in those resorts.

 

[minnie61650]

My first visceral response to this was: "No way would I buy into POP DVC!". And I love Pop Century! My second thought was ... hmmm ... "Maybe I would stay there if the point rates were very, very low. Half that of OKW or SSR.". Maybe there is a place for a "value" DVC! But I also see a serious problem with regular POP guests using DVC facilities (pool, laundry, etc). Honestly, I am surprised that there are not more BWI and BC guests who use the free DVC laundry in those resorts.

The themed pool area could be gated like SAB and maybe use the room key for access. The laundry room could also require a key card for access.

Edited to add: Or they could leave the the gap in bridge so guests are not able to easily walk from one side to the other.

Just a couple of my thoughs.

 

[tasha99]

So, is OKW and SSR worth $300/night rack rate or $85/night including free dining?

Again, I submit that Disney is cheapening the DVC brand by upgrading from value to DVC.

I've always equated my DVC accommodations and experience to a deluxe, NOT a value. That's why, IMHO, they charge so much for rack rate. And, that's why I paid so much to join DVC. And there's a reason why OKW & SSR are $300+ a night and attracts people who want that experience, and there's a reason why All Stars is $85 a night (including free dining).

I don't think it's a good thing to blurry the difference between the two, because what will happen is not bringing All Stars up to DVC, rather lowering DVC to value.



ETA: Again, just to be clear, when I stay at WDW for cash, I stay at Value, so I'm not looking down on anyone or anything. There is (overall) a distinct difference in the people, in the feel, in the cast members, etc. between the resort categories. If you don't believe me, just for fun, take a ride on a Grand Floridian Bus, then take a ride on a All Stars Bus. You'll notice a different feel.

I certainly wouldn't pay extra to join DVC if it offered the "value experience." I did pay extra (with two add-ons) to join the DVC where I was surrounded by people who either paid $300+ a night to be there, or tens of thousands of dollars to be there. You take that out, and OKW & SSR are nothing more than Pop Century with kitcheonettes.

Are you against Priceline? Hotels on Priceline often go for around 25% of rack rate.

 

[minnie61650]

So, is OKW and SSR worth $300/night rack rate or $85/night including free dining?

I think it is worth is $300/night rack rate to many.
What you do not seem to understand is not all value guests who paid $85 a night to stay at a value are being offered the upgrade. It was a few compared to the thousands who are booked for free dining. This was an upgrade(hence the word upgrade). It can be compared to winning a contest or getting a little pixie dust.
Most, if not all of the Value guests who were upgraded from a Value resort to a DVC had no idea when booking their value room that an upgrade would be offered to them. .

I certainly wouldn't pay extra to join DVC if it offered the "value experience." I did pay extra (with two add-ons) to join the DVC where I was surrounded by people who either paid $300+ a night to be there, or tens of thousands of dollars to be there. You take that out, and OKW & SSR are nothing more than Pop Century with kitcheonettes.

I agree with Chuck S that you wasted your money if you thought you were joining a exclusive club where only the elite could stay when you joined DVC.

You think OKW & SSR are nothing more than"Pop Century with kitcheonettes"?
What about the themed pools, larger rooms, nicer furniture, the sit down restaurants etc.? Don't they count as part of the DVC experience?

 

[zalansky]

I hope that Pop Century rumor is just that - rumor. I didn't pay all this money to buy DVC to cheapen it by building at a value. No way!

I haven't read the entire thread, do we know what happened here? Did Disney truly over-book Pop and they are sending some people to SSR. The speculation seems to be that they are possibly doing it for marketing purposes. If that were the case, I think they'd be much better off bumping people from WL, AKL, POLY, etc - deluxes - into a DVC to get them to buy. I don't see the majority of people who stay at a value plunking down $16,000+ for a vacation club membership. There is no value there. Don't get me wrong, for us, clearly there is value because in our minds you can't put a price on memories that DVC brings....anyway we bought in and we happened to buy because when we were staying at WL one weekend, there was an offer in our room to tour DVC and get $100 Disney Dollars. Voila. We bought.